Blah blah. You’re just grasping at straws in an attempt to support your point. I’m talking about facts, not about whatever future fairytale scenario you can think up.

“Honestly, the rigid thinking of coders astounds me.”

First, I am not a coder. Secondly, it may seem rigid to you because I don’t bend it to fit whatever stupid claim of the day I’m trying to support, unlike you. REALITY is rigid. Reality doesn’t flex just because it’s convenient for your argument. As for your “cluster or cloud of motions”, it’s plain gibberish, as your new wording of “emulated” instead of “copy” shows.

“instead, the entire withering scorn of your whopping um…25 years? 22 years? is brought down like a ton of bricks, in scathing rage, like an Old Testament prophet, bringing righteous wrath down upon the unfaithful.”

Uh huh. You’re projecting again. I’ve stuck to facts and stated things that are real. You’re the one rambling on about “what ifs” and “maybes” like it’s a question of faith.

“PERMISSIONS is something that has to be looked at 360 degrees, and thought about. You’re assuming that nothing will ever change about permissions, forever, and ever, amen.”

Like I said, I’m talking about the present. Nowhere will you be able to point to where I’ve stated permissions will never change in the future. In fact, the closest thing you can find is quite the opposite, where I’ve said it’s been broken in the past.

“You represent only a tiny, extreme faction in the broad debate about these things.”

You’ve just described yourself to a T. “screeching hysterics” indeed.

As for the opensourcing of the client. You’re projecting again, assuming an opinion where none is to be found. Certainly not in my posts here.

“Yes, you are absolutely akin to a virus-writer, because of the arrogance and malicious glee you take in both besting people and making them look stupid, and your superiority in thinking that you know best, and that your take on the problems of SL are all that matter.”

You just described yourself to a T again. Especially that little gleeful smiley you tack on when you think you’ve been particularily clever in smearing someone. “and that your take on the problems of SL are all that matter” is especially fitting you.

This is a very cramped and rigid notion of what a hack could be. Anything that talks can be interfered with. There may be new and brilliant ways to hack that don’t involve the human factor of the client-side rendering only. The unthinkable can and does happen with technology all the time, as history amply shows us. The facts always must be questioned. Who is to say that a viewer being coded up this minute won’t also somehow be able to hack into server code. After all, how was this rogue server able to be made? Honestly, the rigid thinking of coders astounds me.

A normal response of a normal, non-zealous, thinking person might go like this: “You know, it doesn’t work that way, in fact the server-side is protected from being read by the permissions system and the client-side doesn’t ever see it the way it is set up now, but of course, hacking via the human factor is always possible, and perhaps there is some remote possibility of some other kind of copying we haven’t heard of yet, say, a mapping of the motions of a scripted item against the commands always known to match those motions in items in world, and the generation of some cluster or cloud of motions that if mapped on enough objects enough times might generate some emulated code — or who the hell knows, we must leave the door open, of course, but in general, protection of scripts is pretty secure for now”.

Instead, the entire withering scorn of your whopping um…25 years? 22 years? is brought down like a ton of bricks, in scathing rage, like an Old Testament prophet, bringing righteous wrath down upon the unfaithful.

PERMISSIONS is something that has to be looked at 360 degrees, and thought about. You’re assuming that nothing will ever change about permissions, forever, and ever, amen. I have absolutely no faith in you or that statement. Because things change, all the time.

There are exploits that never get fixed. I know the ones in the group tools haven’t been fixed. Nobody likes to think about them, talk about them, or work on them. They aren’t fun. It’s those unfun exploits that are always the ones used to bring down the house.

You represent only a tiny, extreme faction in the broad debate about these things. In Second Life, we’re always treated to the depradations of the screeching hysterics, who sit on forums and rant and rave from positions of absolute hacksterish Linux IRC channel nutterhood, but more moderate and sophisticated people don’t take this position whatsoever. On Linux pages you can even find Linux nutters debating that it was perhaps not a great idea to opensource the client. There is a range of opinion that no one would ever know about, listening only to the screeching, hysterical voices within the tiny pond of SL. And that’s the problem, really, is that the Lindens have an amen-corner of your sort, and nothing more grown up influencing them or interacting with them on any kind of real basis, as they are in a sequestered cult. The coders are beyond the influence even of Lindens within LL, looks like. This is a dangerous, brittle situation; an accident going somewhere to happen. It’s that brittle arrogance that always precedes downfalls like the hacking of the dbase on Sept. 6 or the appearnance of Copybot Nov. 6 (no accident, comrade?)

The human factor, were it to hack, would likely first seize money, but then next, it would go after scripts.

Why would I say that? From observing how the human factor actually works. When Plastic Duck and co. hacked those big six or whatever inworld companies back in 2005, they took…scripts. When nimrod hacked the vendor he took…scripts. Scripts are what make the world work. A haxxor nerdnik is not going to take prim hair and shoes.

Yes, you are absolutely akin to a virus-writer, because of the arrogance and malicious glee you take in both besting people and making them look stupid, and your superiority in thinking that you know best, and that your take on the problems of SL are all that matter.

I think any sensible grown-up with even a modicum of intelligence and management skills would come up to this situation we have here and pronounce it: “An accident going somewhere to happen”. And it’s precisely because people won’t admit that they don’t know, or that the worst is possible, or that they are flawed (remember Andromeda Strain?)

“Did you think that permissions were sacrosant in SL? That accounts can never be hacked? And that the permissions system can never be hacked? And that human error can never be at fault for accidently releasing copyable scripts? All of these and more are all factors which you just aren’t willing to concede.”

If you read my post, you’ll perhaps comprehend that that’s exactly the opposite of what I wrote. I said the permissions HAD been broken. What I also said is that if someone hacks into your account (human factor), everything is vulnerable, textures, scripts, animations, EVERYTHING. So singling out scripts and yelling “see, see it’s vulnerable!” is irrelevant. THAT is your failure to comprehend basic written english. So no, there’s nothing here to concede, you just agreed to what I wrote.

Blah blah blah rant rant “Scripts are copyable. They can be copied. The way in which they can be copied is different than textures can be copied. But they can be copied, and ported easily.”

If you have permissions to edit them, yes. Which is what has been said all along. DUH.

“You folks know a lot about hacking into accounts.”
Actually I don’t.

“I know nothing, it’s not my area.”
Oh?
“And one way it’s done is because people make guessable passwords or they tell them to others.”

“The idea that exploits can always be fixed; that they CAN be fixed is the sort of brittle, orthodox thinking we’ve come to expect from”

Exploits get fixed. There has been exploits to bypass permissions, they’ve been fixed. Q.E.D.

“screeching, zealous orthodox coders,”
To which I (or you, rather) say: “Try to discuss ideas, and stop it with the personal attacks.”

“who have no ability to think out of the box,”
Uh huh, that’s why you repeat the same fallacies and straw men over and over.

“And who says your client receiving a texture “to wrap around your avatard” … “can’t be fixed”? Who says?”

I do. And just about everyone else with a clue about how that works. Which is to say, not you. Do you want to DRM everything from the pipe to your monitor? That would be the movie and music industry’s wet dream.

“people for whom they have contempt. It drips from your every word.”

There we go again, delusions of grandeur. What I have contempt for is you, not the “people”, or content creators, whom I have supported with thousands of L$ buying their products.

“People who think that in dealing with a society made up of humans, the “human factor” is irrelevant never last long.”

There you go, making up shit about people you dislike again. What I said was that the “human factor” was equally dangerous to ALL assets, if an account hacked. Therefore, citing the human factor when applied to SCRIPTS, is irrelevant when comparing them to other assets.

“I understand more and more why RL forces seek so aggressively to annihilate you.” and “No, I’m merely commenting on the aggressiveness with which all these anti-spyware sorts of things exist to defeat all the fucktards who make viruses for sport and malicious glee.”

Make up your mind, are you talking about me or are you talking about virus writers? Because I sure as hell do not make viruses, and I take great offense if you try to liken me to the people that do.

“Once again, your responses illustrate the deep fallacies and deep flaws in thinking of the coding class.”

The only thing illustrated here is your lack of understanding of even the most basic systems in SL. That, and your lack of understanding of basic written english.

Instead, like a broken record, you keep pronouncing doctrines and dogmas from your scripters’ lexicon, attempting, like a latter-day priest, to impress us with your knowledge. It’s useless. SL changes, and even these factors change. Scripts are copyable. They can be copied. The way in which they can be copied is different than textures can be copied. But they can be copied, and ported easily.

You folks know a lot about hacking into accounts. I know nothing, it’s not my area. But it’s done all the time. And one way it’s done is because people make guessable passwords or they tell them to others. This is such a big problem, the Lindens put log-on messages about it for 7 days in a row.

I am aware. All you have to do is read the forums and blogs. And that lets me know that this is as possible to happen any time or no time as the Copybot was as possible to happen any time or not time, the chances were maybe less, but the possibility is always there. The idea that exploits can always be fixed; that they CAN be fixed is the sort of brittle, orthodox thinking we’ve come to expect from screeching, zealous orthodox coders, who have no ability to think out of the box, retain any sort of Socratic inquirity or flexibility, and do nothing but recite memes all day that they’ve learned from their elders and betters.

And who says your client receiving a texture “to wrap around your avatard” (yeah, nice attitude toward people and their attitudes wrapped around THAT silly word) “can’t be fixed”? Who says? Maybe it can. Certainly with the WILL to fix it, sometimes the WAY can be found.

One thing is clear, the coding class has every reason to keep their Holy Writ from being copied, but no reason to stop the copying of people’s stuff — people for whom they have contempt. It drips from your every word.

It’s good to see this, so that people can begin to take measures now to control your viciousness and malice.

Citing “human factors” for scripts is not irrelevant; indeed, the “human factor” is the greatest factor there is. If it weren’t for this contemptible arrogance and malice that the makers of CopyBot had for other people and their stuff, CopyBot would never have happened. People who had the equivalent of CopyBot wit GLintercept were quiet about it, and didn’t disrupt the society and create a social phenomenon.

People who think that in dealing with a society made up of humans, the “human factor” is irrelevant never last long.

I personally don’t “wish to annihilate anyone who disagrees with me”. This is the typical annihilation THEY engage in by claiming that of me lol. It’s funny to watch, really. No, I’m merely commenting on the aggressiveness with which all these anti-spyware sorts of things exist to defeat all the fucktards who make viruses for sport and malicious glee. I can understand why so much time and money is spent on it. I personally just try to understand these things, since sitting at my desktop, obviously I don’t have the power to annihilate anything lol.

Once again, your responses illustrate the deep fallacies and deep flaws in thinking of the coding class.

Apparently it is closer to rocket science than your ability to understand it. It gives you the content of the script when you OPEN it, IF you have mod perms. If you don’t, then you are never sent the contents, and I’d like to hear you try to explain how it’s “child’s play” to break that.

“In fact, unlike prims, scripts can even be transported out of the world of SL and sent by email across grids, i.e. from adult to teen or visa versa, and sent to other worlds.”

Thank you for that rare insight, Captain Obvious. With mod perms, you can open a script, copy it, paste it into a script on the teen grid. DUH.

“Hacking into an account’s inventory is child’s play.”

Uh huh, I’m sure the Lindens will be contacting you any moment to ask about THAT exploit. As if it wasn’t just something you just pulled out of your ass to try to look knowlegeable.

“Smacking people upside the head doesn’t change these glaring “human factors” lying wait to completely disrupt your zealous faith in the “inviolability of scripts”.”

Again, you go on making up shit and attributing it to people you don’t like. If you weren’t aware, the permission system has been broken in the past, and people have copied scripts. Those were exploits, and they were fixed, because they CAN be fixed. Your client needing to receive a texture to wrap it around your avatard can NOT be fixed, however.

Any content is “vulnerable” to social engineering, so citing human factors for scripts is irrelevant.

“I understand more and more why RL forces seek so aggressively to annihilate you.”

“RL forces” meaning you, Prok, you want to annihilate anyone who don’t agree with your fucked up neo-commie world view.