Controversial German Designer Returns From Her 8th Suspension – Interview 2/2

by Alphaville Herald on 27/02/05 at 12:51 am

Athel Richelieu’s screen-shot of the now-erased compound, moments before he abuse-reported it. SS logo in foreground.

by Neal Stewart

In part two of our interview with controversial designer Katja Eisenberg, Katja responds to allegations that she is a Neo-Nazi and connoisseur of racist humour. She explains her true views on Adolf Hitler, George Bush, the recent anniversary of Dresden, illegal swastikas, the SS uniform, and the quality of my fangs. Friend Mike Czukor also presents an alternative view to that of Katja’s critics and suggests that Katja is herself the victim of racism.

(Continued from Part 1/2)…

Neal Stewart: Evil L.L.P also claims that you liked to make jokes that they considered racist. Is that true?
Katja Eisenberg: No, I built a Tsunami and asked them if anyone noticed the huge fucking wave right there in front of them and said it was funny how 150 thousand didn’t see it. I don’t consider that racist.

Neal Stewart: But they say that, in addition to that, you made racist jokes in general.
Katja Eisenberg: Well if I had the time in my busy SL life to remember everything I said then whatever. But I don’t remember saying anything racist.

Neal Stewart: So in general you’re not into racist humour, if you can call it that?
Katja Eisenberg: No, I am not into racist humor. If I felt the need to bash everyone all day I would still be pissed about the suspension. I honestly don’t give a fuck. [...] I am goth. I don’t have a problem with anyone. It seems everyone has the problem with me.


Katja Eisenberg: You have a Family in SL? Because I did. And that was ruined when I was suspended. Now no one seems to believe me.
Neal Stewart: Evil L.L.P was your family?
Katja Eisenberg: No. Mephistophelina was my mother. Malificent Maelstrom is my Aunt. Spencer Ruthledge is my Godmother. Flack Quartermass was my father.

Neal Stewart: Why do you think they misunderstood what you were trying to do with the memorial, and the jokes that they considered racist?
Katja Eisenberg: No. They all knew my intentions with the camp. To build the memorial. They said they had no problem with that as long as LL didn’t. LL did so I tore it down. And if my comments seemed racist then Mike who is Arabic wouldn’t be my friend. And Grandduke who is impotent wouldn’t be my friend and I wouldn’t have a girlfriend seeming as I am a woman.

mike Czukor: I’m Arabic? LOL. I’m Greek but…
Katja Eisenberg: Oh. Greek. Whatever.
mike Czukor: Germans took over Greece.
Katja Eisenberg: *giggles*
mike Czukor: I should say ‘Nazis’. LOL. And I’m part German and Italian.

Neal Stewart: Some people are only racist towards specific nationalities. Or consider themselves racist in general but willing to make exceptions.
Katja Eisenberg: I am not racist towards anyone. I think there are a few people who are lazy but I don’t single out races. I am 4’11 in Real Life. You think I can go about running my mouth off and get away with it? UHM, no.
Neal Stewart: Heh heh.
Katja Eisenberg: Well, 5’3 in shoes.

Neal Stewart: So all the Nazi claims are just BS? You don’t in any way identify with the Nazis or any of their beliefs?
mike Czukor: No, Katja helped out a lot of people – including me.
Katja Eisenberg: No, I don’t. I love their uniforms and the history. But I don’t agree with it.
mike Czukor: She’s not a bad person.

Katja’s friend, Mike Czukor: “Katja has helped out a lot of people in SL … She’s a great person”

Neal Stewart: What do you agree with?
Katja Eisenberg: I agree with the fact that in WW2 the German Soldiers were only doing their job. The Nazi’s plan for a perfect Aryan race was not a very good way to do things. I think the Jewish society in itself is pretty lucky to have such strong beliefs.

Neal Stewart: What do you think is a better way to do things?
Katja Eisenberg: I think a better way to do things first off is not to join in on a war or the extermination of a race in any sense. I think – had Hitler stayed sane throughout his Power – he would or may have done things differently. There is a bunch of things that factored into WW2. The German Soldiers do their jobs just as the American soldiers do their jobs. An order is an order whether you want to or not. And when it’s your life or theirs – I think a lot of people would have chose the other person to die.

Neal Stewart: So you believe that Hitler was OK at first but that he became increasingly insane?
Katja Eisenberg: I think Hitler had a lot of problems with Jewish people being that his father beat him. He was of no Jewish blood. So I can’t say why he singled them out. I think to start with the beginning of WW2 Hitler was not a bad person. But as he became more and more insane, then he started doing stupid shit like killing off the Jews. I think to hide the fact WW2 happened is bullshit. I love history and to tell me I cannot share history with people is a load of shit and in itself the way Hitler would have acted. How many people die every single day because of their religion? [...] And the Pentagram is supposedly a Pagan culture symbol. Fuck the pagans right up their asses for using a Symbol of the devil to hide behind their religion. The Swastika is a Tibetan peace symbol. Did you know in SL you can’t even have a proper Swastika because of all the in-bred little fucks walking around here who don’t know history? Fucking pathetic. [...] Gah I really wish I wasn’t that time of the month. I am soon to be banned again. Watch the Lindens flip the fuck out.

Neal Stewart: What about your SS uniform? Did you have to change it from the original so that it would be allowed in SL?
Katja Eisenberg: I didn’t change shit about it. SL is so shitty, their clothing never comes out perfect enough to even show a Swastika. My uniform has nothing Nazi about it.

Neal Stewart: Aren’t the SS, Nazis?
Katja Eisenberg: No, the SS were of the Nazi party but in itself were not Nazi’s. Just the Secret Police of the Nazi party.

Neal Stewart: What interests you in particular about the SS?
Katja Eisenberg: They had the sexiest Uniforms. I love the uniform. Doesn’t mean I love Nazi’s.

Neal Stewart: So, if the Americans had worn the SS uniform and vice versa, you would be interested in the Americans?
Katja Eisenberg: Your god damn right. It’s the Uniform. And the Sense of Strength. Not the execution of the Jewish people.

Neal Stewart: How do you mean, ‘the Sense of Strength’?
Katja Eisenberg: The German army has always been feared and well trained. They are strong and very much respected. Not even necessarily WW2 Germany.

Neal Stewart: What about the Americans?
Katja Eisenberg: I think the American’s are made to be more powerful then they really are. Let’s face it – the strongest country in the world is Israel. Their army is so well trained and strong. They are always at war with religion. [...] I think if the Americans saw how President bush who now control’s the 4th Reich saw things. How he cheated the UN and broke a bill and only was able to because of the patriotism in the US. There would be a lot less going for the US.

Neal Stewart: So it’s not just the SS uniforms you’re interested in, it’s what you see as their strength?
Katja Eisenberg: The Strength. Brotherhood. Family of a Military that is strong. The Uniforms just make it all the funner. Not even the symbols on the Uniforms. A Plain black SS Uniform with nothing on it – to me would be sexiest of all.

Katja Eisenberg: OMMFG. NEAL, NO. Take those shitty fangs from your mouth this instant. God damnit. Here, take this pair.
Here Katja has noticed that I’m sporting fangs and she gives me ‘Angel Fangs 2′.
Katja Eisenberg: Wear those.
Neal Stewart: Heh heh. Thanks. I’ll try them later.
Katja Eisenberg: And if I ever see those pathetic fangs in your mouth again I will kick you in your forehead.

Neal Stewart: So, what do you think about the recent debate in Germany about how to regard the bombing of Dresden [Feb 13,]? I understand that some people believe you can call the bombing a ‘holocaust’ in itself.
Katja Eisenberg: I think the bombing is just like the bombings in the war. A bomb is a bomb. It’s meant to kill and destroy.

Neal Stewart: So you don’t think it’s reasonable to compare the bombing of Dresden to the holocaust?
Katja Eisenberg: No. I don’t think its anything close to the Holocaust.

Neal Stewart: I understand that Swastikas etc are actually illegal in Germany [Jan 17,] unless used for art purposes etc. What are your thoughts on that?
Katja Eisenberg: Good. If it’s a Peace symbol, that is different. But the Swastika itself, no good.

Neal Stewart: OK, but you believe they should be illegal if used in a Nazi context?
Katja Eisenberg: Not illegal – just more thought out.

mike Czukor: I think those Nazi comments [ie. residents who comment that Kajta is a Neo-Nazi] are racist to Katja because she’s German. But not all Germans are Nazis. Very few are.
Neal Stewart: Do you think most Germans in SL are regarded as Nazis?
mike Czukor: Yes, in many peoples opinions. But they aren’t. Katja has helped out a lot of people in SL. She’s helped the community a whole lot and SL should be thanking her. She helped me out and a lot of my friends.

Neal Stewart: How did she help you?
mike Czukor: Well, she showed me around. She gave me things. Let me join her group and basically introduced me to a bunch of new people that are now good friends. She’s a great person. And all this “she’s a Nazi” is a bunch of BS.

Neal Stewart: So she has never said or done anything that you think is racist or sympathetic to Nazism?
mike Czukor: No. And furthermore, why do people just sit here and bitch? Isn’t SL supposed to be about creating your world? She was recreating history. And the fact that they think the swastika is offensive might be offensive to a Tibetan – because it’s their peace symbol. So I think LL should think more carefully.

Neal Stewart: What does your T-shirt say, Katja?
Katja Eisenberg: It’s a punk shirt. It says “Napalm Death: Nazi punks fuck off.” In other words, fuck Nazis.

Neal Stewart: Can I get a picture of you in your uniform?
Katja Eisenberg: *giggles* Evidence to ban us.
mike Czukor: LOL. LMAO.
Neal Stewart: Heh heh
mike Czukor: I’ve served enough banment.
Katja Eisenberg: 8 times for me.
mike Czukor: God.
Neal Stewart: 8?
Katja Eisenberg: Yep, all for the same reason. Misunderstanding.

Neal Stewart: Do you plan to do more builds related to Germany, Katja?
Katja Eisenberg: No.

Katja Eisenberg and Mike Czukor pose in uniform at the Sido sim.

38 Responses to “Controversial German Designer Returns From Her 8th Suspension – Interview 2/2”

  1. Athel Richelieu

    Feb 27th, 2005

    It would be easier to consider Katja’s case if it were not for the blatant lies she made in her interview, and for the fact that many have heard her make racist comments and gestures. From the blantant lies in the first part of this interview it just makes her seem worse to me.

    First of all, in the first part of the interview she claimed the SS symbol was not part of the build and claimed that it is just a “German Military Camp” It appears to be clearly part of the build, and was strategically placed. Even Grandduke said it was an SS Training Camp in our conversation I had with him

    “”(Me): Ahh, you helped make the concentration camp?
    grandduke Ferdinand: that so called “camp”
    grandduke Ferdinand: it was an SS traning camp

    Second of all, Katja claims that there are no “World War II Era Recruiting Posters” in the camp. The poster in the foreground is that has some red in it with a fist on the first bunker on the left hand side, just under my mini-map is this poster:

    which is described at

    and is CLEARLY in World War II Era

    She also had several SS Recruiting Posters up, and Anti-Communist Posters including:
    (These are the only ones I can remember)

    If these are not World War II Era recruiting posters, I don’t know what she calls them.

    The hanging man in the concentration camp prisoner’s outfit just makes it worse for me, as someone indicated it is clearly a concentration camp prisoner’s outfit in the first part of the interview’s comments section (With proof)

    So it leaves me to think Katja is just a particularly disgusting griefer, truly Nazi yet unwilling to fess up in public (For whatever reason I dont know, if she can talk it in SL she should just go ahead and say what she is), racist, or otherwise. What she definitely is a clearly a Liar, as she lies to everyone’s face in the first part of the interview about the camp.

  2. blow me

    Feb 27th, 2005

    For good luck and peace you can chose these world icons….

    Beckoning Cats
    Double Happiness
    Eye of Horus
    Four Leaf Clover
    Fu and Fu Bat
    Laughing Buddha
    Nazar Boncugu
    Red Roses

    So why have have a swastika? Most people only recognise it as a Nazi symbol. Oh wait! that’s the intention. I apolgise to any Tibetans who might be reading, but I’m sure they will inderstand.

  3. Lada Charlton

    Feb 27th, 2005

    Haha! It’s very obvious she’s trying to cover up what ever she did. Her speech seems frantic to me, and I’m sure if this interview were in RL she’d be shaking.

    But you know what I have to say? – So what?

    If she wants to be racist, a neo-nazi, what ever hate group she wants to be a part of.. fine: Just as long as it doesn’t interfere with anyone else.

    I’m positively sure though, that she deserved all 8 of her bannings (I didn’t know one could be banned more than once, I thought it was a done deal) and she’ll probably deserve every next one she gets.

  4. Lada Charlton

    Feb 27th, 2005

    Haha! It’s very obvious she’s trying to cover up what ever she did. Her speech seems frantic to me, and I’m sure if this interview were in RL she’d be shaking.

    But you know what I have to say? – So what?

    If she wants to be racist, a neo-nazi, what ever hate group she wants to be a part of.. fine: Just as long as it doesn’t interfere with anyone else.

    I’m positively sure though, that she deserved all 8 of her bannings (I didn’t know one could be banned more than once, I thought it was a done deal) and she’ll probably deserve every next one she gets.

  5. Artemis Fate

    Feb 27th, 2005

    “Blow me”, I use “Swastika’s” often in my art, But I have no ties to a Nazi order whatsoever, (infact my AV is dark skinned), but the “swastika” where I have learned it was called a Manji, which is the name for it in Japan as well as other asian cultures. To me, the Manji is a symbol of peace, universal balance, and even spirtuality, it means a lot to me and my religion as a Taoist. And everytime someone asks me if i’m wearing a nazi symbol it pains me that people are so stuck in the past that they can’t accept that this symbol existed more than 3 thousand years ago, FAR longer than Hitler’s reign. Even the American government officially cleared the symbol of any Nazi connotations.

    Plug in Manji or Swastika in a search engine and you’ll get thousands of links talking about a lot of countries that made references to it. Certain native american tribes used it, buddhists used it (to mark the steps of Buddha no less), tibetans used it, Chinese used it, Japanese used it. And the fact that you can only see the Nazi usage of it is a little something I like to call blatant ignorance.

    I decided to talk to Katja at one point after I heard about all the grief she went through for her historical project, since i’ve had a little bit for my use of Manjis. And I dont think there’s any way she could possibly be racist or a nazi, and if she was a nazi she wouldnt be a very good one. All the builds she’s been doing lately have been of police vehicles and such, and it’s a shame that her historical building had to have been destroyed. But I know that some people can never leave the past behind them. If you didn’t personally fight in WWII and if you weren’t personally in a concetration camp, hell if you weren’t even ALIVE then, you have absolutely no right to tell them they’re bad. This is how family feuds went, somebody would steal from another family and they would fight for generations until they get to the point where each family asks itself “Why’re we fighting in the first place? Because my father didn’t like them? Because my grandfather didn’t like them?”.

    So personally, I feel unless you have anything but hard evidence (preferably a tape recording of Katja saying “My name is Katja, I am a Nazi, I hate jews”) then stop spewing libel and slander about an innocent person.

    “Innocent until proven guilty” remember?

  6. Athel Richelieu

    Feb 27th, 2005

    For everyone’s information, Artemis happens to be a “close friend” of Katja’s, and for whatever reason defends her until the end.

    Katja is obviously a liar and a griefer and many people know it.. She may really even be very Nazi, and if not she is definitely acting like she is.

    And we all are not stupid enough to believe that all those who use swastikas can use the “good luck” defence though you yourself may indeed do it. And for your information, do use the turned swastika? why can you not use the upright one which the Buddhists and others normally use? The “good luck” swastika is normally upright, the Nazi swastika is tilted leftward (With a negative connotation anyway). There is a difference…..

  7. Since I Wasnt Interviewed

    Feb 27th, 2005

    The day Katja was putting up her concentration camp on the island I came over to see what it was. I asked, she said it was a prison camp and asked that I thought of it. I said it depends on what all you plan on putting in it. She said ovens, gas showers, etc. She was even building a rail road track but complained about the # of prims. She said this was for efficient processing. She then asked me again what I thought. I said it was racists and disgusting. She then played several audio files of a speech she wanted me to hear. The speech basically said when the jews came to germany they brought nothing, then they started devouring Germanys resources and wealth like a disease and that a cure (the holocaust) was coming. After it finished playing she asked me again what I thought. I said the same thing as before. She then went off on me and started talking to me like I was sub human.

    Later that day I came back again. Katja was standing next to the camp with some friends and had a row of hanging bodys (the ones with the concentration camp uniforms on) next to the fence of her camp. She saw me coming and immediately started deleting them so I couldnt see them, but she wasnt fast enough. About that time is when she started constructing the huge tsunami. Her comments about the people that suffered in the recent tragedy were that they deserved it and it was gods way of cleaning up the filth from the earth.

    I wish I had pictures but at the time I considered myself somewhat of a friend of Katjas and that she was ‘unique’. But it wasnt until she ignored the wishes of the island group and continued in her negative waves did I see how Katja treats and manipulates people. People defending her are truely blind and are being played by her.

  8. Katja Eisenberg

    Feb 27th, 2005

    So many people to say so much. Yet half the people who have bashed me I have never spoken too. in the words of a good Pron star… Ron Jeremy “BLOW ME”

  9. Since I Wasnt Interviewed

    Feb 27th, 2005

    There isnt much to say Katja. You can deny the intention of things like saying the dead guy wasnt a jew even though he had on the clothes so often seen in those camps from that time period. You can deny things you’ve said that many people have heard. You can deny until the cows come home. But if the Lindens ever went and restored your inventory from back then to another server or AV and went through it, they’d find things like the anti-semetic sound bytes you played for me personally that preaches the need to get rid of the jews. That is one thing you cant deny the intention of. And when you put the mountain of other things you deny next to it: its a duck.

  10. Artemis Fate

    Feb 27th, 2005

    I actually wasnt a close friend of Katja’s, I only even talked to her first a few days ago when I wanted to see for myself what she was like (I tend to do that, get first person experiences of a person before I judge them), and even when I first talked to her she thought I was going to shoot her.

    And I use the reveresed Manji, Athel, but you’re wrong. Both ways have meanings in Buddhism; an Omote manji is what I most often use (partially to shake nazi connotations) and the Ura manji is the other way around. Both of them mean something by themselves. The Omote manji is most commonly a symbol of Buddha, and stands for infinite mercy and the love of dharma, while the Ura manji represents intellect and strength. Generally they’re used side by side in Buddhism. Although the Omote manji shows up alone more often then the Ura manji.

    And what “Since I didn’t get interviewed” said about Katja, maybe it’s true maybe it’s not, but like I said earlier, I refuse to make judgements on anyone based on rumours or from people I dont know or even people I may know but not fully trust. So until I see Katja do any of this myself i’ll refuse to believe it.

  11. Cinda

    Feb 27th, 2005

    well there ya go, how can you doubt someone who’d quote Ron Jeremy? I rest my case…………………………

  12. Dominik Bauer

    Feb 27th, 2005

    …and Katja Eisenberg is not even german. She is of romanian nationality…just on a sidemark.

    A few comments to the article, from one who studied history in a university.
    Hitler was far from being anywhere near harmless before he got into power. His book “Mein Kampf”/”My Struggle” is evidence enough to show his actual plans and his inhumane antisemitic propaganda.

    The comparison of the bombing of Dresden with the holocaust is unspeakably wrong! Dresden was a military operation by allied forces. From a humanitarian point of view certainly not the best one but in a way it was called for by the nazi regime. Don´t forget that the Nazis attacked London and the south of England with V2, not to mention what other incredibly cruel and inhumane crimes the “Wehrmacht” / german army did to civilians during the russian campaign, in the Balkan etc.
    The holocaust was genocide and planned killing of 6 to 8,000,000 people including the own population just because they had another religion, another sexual preference or were disabled in the nazis twisted point of view. Not even the numbers allow a comparison. It´s an unspeakable tragedy and crime to mankind. People who don´t learn from history are bound to make the same mistakes again. A human´s dignity is untouchable.
    And a slight suggestion…Katja, just build a Guantanamo Bay camp…I´d like to see if you get banned for that. Would be worth an experiment.

  13. Katja Eisenberg

    Feb 27th, 2005

    Dom you are more knowledgable then most of the people in this game. And I admire you for that. And also Cinda Valentino is no better then me if I am in anysense a bad person in everyone elses eyes. She calls on her friends to grief for her so that way she doesn’t get into trouble then brags how she has never been caught. Well Cinda. Quoting ron Jeremy is my way of saying Fuck you to ugly inbread deusch bags like you. Keep up the good work griefer. At least I can show my creativity by creating something that actually involves intellect and neurons. So when you come and see one of my builds and it makes you feel pathetic that the work you put into your shitty builds like your High rise which is just a few pillars with some floors not even walled up. Then youc an tell me my builds are wrong. Until then cunt shut your mouth and keep to your own work. Go Grief someone who gives a fuck.

  14. Cate

    Feb 28th, 2005

    “No, the SS were of the Nazi party but in itself were not Nazi’s. Just the Secret Police of the Nazi party.”

    should I draw the venn diagram to that quote?

    first she says all that interests her about SS is the unifrom but then she starts revealing that its really the “sense of strength”. she doesnt like the uniform just because of the way the material looks. shes about what the SS uniform symbolizes and it’s not puppies.

    A tibetan will be offended by someone who says they’re using a tibetan swastika in there german military camp.

    how much patience does linden labs have! letting someone keep coming back after 8 bans!

  15. In a way, I almost admire Katja for having such audacity. It was always one of the things I admired about her, for it is a rare person who is truly willing to push the envelope of social convention.

    However, in a world of fiction facilitated through anonymity, it doesn’t truly require *that* much courage to be extreme, and her boldness often crossed the line into an appalling fury of outrageous hostility. Much of what was said here is shamelessly false or at least distorted, and it appears as though she’s changed her opinions quite profoundly from what they used to be. I suppose one could argue that this is artistic license, as well.

    To be fair to Katja, it is important to make clear that Evil, L.L.P. was undergoing some transitional growing pains once Cythera was purchased (originally owned by another one of our officers, until I recently acquired it) that manifested as a lot of confusion and disorganization. It took some time before all of this could be straightened out, and during that period, Katja was a part of our group and many of us tried to befriend her – and yes, even take her in as family – though this unfortunately didn’t work out as we would have liked.

    Katja was asked to leave our group due to a multitude of problems, of which her Auschwitz build and Nazi fanaticism was just one facet, and she left of her own volition. This removed her ability to build on the island, and we hoped that would be enough. Yet, her actions continued to cause issue with our group members and officers.

    Because of the island-ownership confusion, it was not until recently that our group was able to express a clear, unanimous decision regarding Katja, and so it would be understandable if she felt she received mixed or vague messages until that point. The truth is that she probably did. Still, this doesn’t justify her actions anymore than it would be justifiable for someone to graffiti your house with swastikas simply because you let them stay as a guest.

    Since I’ve taken over ownership of the island, I have elected to honor the wishes of my officers, our original vision and my own conscience in this matter. Also, I decided that I’m not paying $200USD a month to sponsor this kind of chaos.

    Regarding whether Katja did or did not do these things, or is or is not a Nazi… undeniably, it *is* a question of who you will believe. I urge everyone to decide for themselves what to make of Katja, as it is definitely only our word against hers and the smattering of available evidence that is open to the interpretation of the observer.

    Concerning the philosophical aspect of this whole affair, I’ve heard all the arguments – the most popular being that she has the sovereign right to freedom of expression, and anyone who forcibly obstructs her “art” is a naughty censor. However the fact remains that SL is not a country; it is a product owned by a business. Our island is not a democratic nation; it is space on a server that I am paying to rent. Therefore, if we are to consider what Katja created to be art, that would make me the former sponsor (insofar as her creations on our island went), and I withdrew that sponsorship because it isn’t the kind of art I want to pay for.

    I can’t speak for the Lindens, obviously, but if I owned a business based on a product like SL, and I were accountable to investors and customers of a wide range of nationalities and creeds, I would certainly not want to put all that at risk in order to allow for the racist profanity of one individual. Whatever you may think of corporate censorship, surely most anyone could understand the logic of that.

    Even so, I wish Katja all the best.

  16. Gia

    Feb 28th, 2005

    You know, I really had respect for her until she said “fuck the pagans”. After that I really didn’t care what else she had to say. As far as I am concerned, maybe it was a mistake to allow her back into the program with the rest of us.


  17. blow me

    Feb 28th, 2005

    “If you didn’t personally fight in WWII and if you weren’t personally in a concetration camp, hell if you weren’t even ALIVE then, you have absolutely no right to tell them they’re bad.” (Artemis Fate)

    This is most stupid, fucked up comment I have ever heard. Please let this comment be a sick joke made to annoy. This is hundred times worse than parading around in silly uniforms with swastikas(good luck signs). You call everyone else ignorant!!? GO LEARN SOME HISTORY, just because something happened before you were born doesn’t make it irrelevant.

  18. Urizenus

    Feb 28th, 2005

    I couldn’t agree more with Blow Me on this. Artemis, did your brain temporarily roll out of your ear when you said that? I mean, what were you thinking?

  19. Jhanniss Fairlight

    Feb 28th, 2005

    People say and do things without thinking sometimes and I’m sure that’s the case for a good many in this little discussion. People are right, I have never been to this build or seen these reported offensive materials, but anyone who is building a concentration camp and has symbols remotely resembling something from history that been deemed racist and offensive should reconsider. Yes I know there are different kinds of those nazi symbols. I cant assume because I only know what history has shown me, and the one the nazi’s used will forever overshadow the other meaning(s) of the others that the same.

  20. Kingey Oz

    Feb 28th, 2005

    “But I know that some people can never leave the past behind them. If you didn’t personally fight in WWII and if you weren’t personally in a concetration camp, hell if you weren’t even ALIVE then, you have absolutely no right to tell them they’re bad.”

    By the same token, Artemis…oh, why bother.

  21. Artemis Fate

    Feb 28th, 2005

    I mean there’s a difference between personal offense and seeing it as a historical atrocity. I look at the crusades, the Holocaust, Tripolyie, Custard’s last stand, all of these historical tradgedies or places with huge losses in troops or civililians with a sense of that it may be a horrible thing to the side or person who got the brunt end of it all, but to me it’s just a historical foot note. I recognize it as bad, but I dont feel personally offended by it, as a lot of you still seem to be in any reference to Nazis.

    It was bad wording on my part.

    Because something happened before I was born it was history, I run on first person experiences and therefore I dont treat every bit of history recent or past as a kick to the head.

    But then again I dont get offended really easily.

  22. Pirate Cotton

    Mar 1st, 2005

    Mmmm. Custard.

  23. Cate

    Mar 1st, 2005

    the distinction is that the Indians from Custard’s last stand aren’t going to be knocking on your door any time soon. but nazism is alive, well and kicking. nazism is not a historical footnote. it is a current and future news headline.

  24. Artemis Fate

    Mar 1st, 2005

    There’s Indian reservations in many parts of America still, not like they would be doing anything but if they wanted they could. And those people now are “Neo-Nazis”. There’s a difference in that they’re a shambled and more misled youth version of it’s former selves more kids who feel rejected can join and beat up people until they grow up or get sent to jail. I have as much threat from Neo-Nazis as I do from any other punk or thug on the streets. There’s no actual military movement in the name of Nazism though.

    If she was going to make a building of Al Quieda hanging American soldiers or something THEN it’d be way pushing it. But saying there was some historical event where the Al Quieda hung American soldiers, and someone made a build of it a few years after the war is over, then it’s a historical build to me.

  25. unhygienix

    Mar 1st, 2005

    Limited Liability Partnership, indeed!

    What dark fetid (feted? :p) cesspit of souls must Hitler be stuck in, if even Evil (LLP) will not touch him with a 10-meter by 0.1-meter by 0.1-meter cylindrical prim?

  26. Jhanniss Fairlight

    Mar 2nd, 2005

    My only retort to the comments, sis, is this. If I go and prop a burning cross on some black AVs plot of land, can we call it a historical build too?

    I remember a few people who went parading around SL in white hoods and robes many months back.

    The only place ANY of these things should be, is in a history book. Reguardless of the historical value or whatever people want to perceive it as, its offensive: morally and socially.

  27. Artemis Fate

    Mar 2nd, 2005

    “The right to swing my fist ends where the other man’s nose begins.” -Benjamin Franklin

    The idea is that my right to do what I want goes as far as till it starts hurting other people. A cross on someone’s av plot is much more different than a german build on a private plot, a plot of which they can do whatever they want with.

    Now you may say that people were offended by this, but what is offense? After all, these are just shapes and colours, how does one get offended by shapes and colours? So obviously it’s not the shape itself that is getting to people, but the person behind that shape and meaning. After all i’m not offended by this build, therefore the build cannot be considered universally offensive, which means offensive in itself is subjective to the person.

    Do you get offended everytime you take a history class, read a history book, or watch a historical movie? Write angry letters to everyone who publishes these that they’re Nazis for showing the true historical content of something happened? No, i’d hope not. So why attack Katja over it? I’ve never noticed all these stories of nazism and hate coming from Katja, the only thing she seems to hate is all this because of all the people that scarcely even know her giving her negative press here that’s lost her a lot of friends.

  28. Athel Richelieu

    Mar 2nd, 2005

    It is really sad you continue to attempt to justify Katja’s actions Artemis, and are unwilling to see her uglier side which so many others with credibility and no reason to lie have said she has.

  29. Artemis Fate

    Mar 2nd, 2005

    I’ve seen a lot of people who have never lied before that “embellish” the truth sometimes, therefore I only believe it when I see it and she’s shown me nothing to make me believe it so far.

    Is it worse that I wont admit that Katja is a Nazi, or that you wont admit that she isnt? It’s the same thing. People are as you see them, no one is universally likeable, and no one is universally hateable. What I mean is everyone’s views are subjective, so I’ll only trust my own before I smear someone’s Second Life.

  30. Katja the Goddess

    Mar 2nd, 2005

    Athel. Take your dick out of your boyfriends ass. Fly your ass over to my land we can have a real discussion on my actions and why it was done since your nose is so far into the game that you don’t really know where your head is. I have an idea fuck head. Since you seem to bash me without knowing me. Maybe I should post a few pictures of some of the stuff you do to my gay friends and see how offensive it is to them. Go play with your dolls cutie. I have better things to do then sit here and watch you cry over something you know nothing about. You are probably a 14 year old boy trying to get his rocks off on some sick fantasy walked across some land. Felt left out and needed attention so y ou went about babbling off to the lindens. You don’t like what you see. STAY THE FUCK OFF THE LAND.

  31. Neal Stewart

    Mar 3rd, 2005

    Dominik Bauer wrote:
    “…and Katja Eisenberg is not even german. She is of romanian nationality…just on a sidemark.”

    Dominik, thank you for your post and IM regarding the article. I have checked with Katja and she confirms that she was born in Romania but is a German Citizen. So, the original “German Designer” title is correct.


  32. J

    Mar 3rd, 2005

    Real mature reply, you build an offensive “shrine” glorifying a horrific event of genocide and bloodshed, and then start using “gay” as an insult (Which really doens’t help you on your “i’m not a nazi” stance) and saying “DON’T LIKE IT DON’T LOOK AT IT!” Well that’s not how the real world works, there is free speech and there is idiocy, if I disagree with a certain political figure then that is free speech, if I say I hate all black/white/asian/(insert religious group here), then I am an idiot.

    Whether or not she was a nazi doesn’t matter, you don’t have to be a KKK member to be a black hater either.

    And I love how katja goes “I have better things to do than to listen to some 14 year old cry about something he knows nothing about.” We know about the holocaust because of history books (and no you worthless waste of carbon, not all history books or anti-nazi agenda material is by jews.)

  33. Athel Richelieu

    Mar 3rd, 2005

    Ok Katja, well since I know what I am and obviously you don’t or are unwilling to fess up to it any of your crude insults arent going to bother me. LOL.

    Any way. I do have to say that, despite me being not Jewish, that the majority of Jews are far more descent people than you :) . In fact, the majority of people are far more descent than you.

    Thank you, have a nice day.

  34. Bob

    Mar 3rd, 2005

    Swearing like a sailor and homophobic comments lend little credibility to, “Oh. It’s so you have good luck in german buildings located in Tibet.” On the other hand, so what? Expression is expression. Tacky? Offensive? Flamebait? Hate-filled? All that and more! But Voltaire’s comment is because decency is such a slippery slope.

    I think this all can be settled on whether or not she’s run off a bridge by a 1974 Dodge Monaco.

  35. Typhaeon

    Mar 9th, 2005

    Wow, way to have absolutely no concept of logic, wanting whatever you don’t like censored and having absolutely no clue about what free expression means, you tremendous douchebags. I suppose you’re proof positive that Rousseau’s loathsome Social Contract philosophy is alive and well in this day and age.

    Linden Labs needs to stop listening to majoritarian tyranny and respect the rights of the unpopular minorities. This is supposedly a medium where people can express themselves, but when you add in all these limp-wristed half-assed rules all you get is a pointless, watered-down GAME when you could have a WORLD.


  36. Marc Eisenberg

    Mar 22nd, 2005

    The most entertaining part of my day is reading about drama, and the Herald is so damn full of it. Basically, it comes down to this… there’s a single majority and one to many minorities in every possible situation, and there always will be. The majority will always have the upper hand, and that can be a good or bad thing… of course, that depends entirely upon whether or not you are part of the majority or minority. Problem is that three common properties of the majority is group ignorance, manipulative agendas, and alterior motives… just look at the republican party. (I agree that Bush is basically the Hitler of today, and that the majority of Americans are following behind him praising him the same way that the majority of Germans praised Hitler… this just proves my ideology about how important perspective is in all of this)

    The way I see it, all of this back and forth nonsense creates a much-needed balance. If the minorities didn’t exist, then everyone would be the same and there would never be any conflicts, and those who would normally reside in the majority group of the world would have no one to come down upon. A real utopia that would be… unfortunately, Utopia will never exist as long as there are different ways of looking at the world, and I personally have to say, “Thank God for that.”

    I’m not saying that Katja is right or wrong in her beliefs… as a matter of fact, I couldn’t care less about anyone else’s beliefs but my own, and I’d hope that she would mind her own about mine as well… but if she didn’t, again, I really couldn’t care less. I would just put her on mute and call it a day if it bugged me that much (which nothing ever does because I’m very open minded towards others). I think that one should be allowed to believe whatever they want without other people coming down on them when its not their place, because I would expect the same respect back. For everyone involved, such as those that own the island and what not, I’m sure you had your reasons since it was your land or your group or blah blah blah, and that’s fine. I can completely understand that. Free speech doesn’t always exist in your neighbor’s backyard.

    There’s so much controversy in this story that I don’t even know where to begin. All I know is that the ignorant majority will eventually squash all of the minorities, then the manipulative, two-faced members of the would-be majority would turn the tables on everyone else in order to create a new conflict since they already squashed everything else they used to argue about, and the days of free speech are over, Second Life will vanish from the face of the Earth, and we will all be forced to live our Real Life in fear of being accused of DoubleThink and talking in NewSpeak, because I can guarantee you that the majority doesn’t really know what they are asking for when they want the minorities to disappear. (Run-on sentence is for effect)

    I do not live in fear of anything, except the loss of my right and everyone else’s right to free speech. So please, everyone, continue battling out these silly battles until the universe collapses upon itself… as long as someone hates someone else for something, whether it be a minority hating a group of people for whatever stereotypical reason they may have or the majority hating the minority for hating a stereotype, that means my rights and everyone else’s rights to free speech will continue to survive.

    Now, back to your regularly scheduled flaming session.

  37. Anonymous

    May 16th, 2005

    This is a very interesting story. I personally know Katja in RL and I can tell you one thing… You’ve all been had and are a part of unneccessary drama.

  38. flavian

    Jun 19th, 2005

    I know Katja from SL. We met whe she was driving around in a cop car and I jumped in and rode around with her. The thing that attracted me to her as a friend is she always has somthing going on, drama, projects, new groups, new friends. She adds alot of flavor to SL. She has alot of engery and always pushes the boundries of what socially acceptable. As for the Nazi shit, I dont judge. The shit aint allowed in Germany so she has it in SL, so what. Taboo is part of the attraction. I believe if somthing else was such a raw nerve on society she would be right there prodding it as well. For no other reason than to watch everyones reaction. I have alot of respect for her just because she does what she wants and dosent care what you or I think

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