No Life-Logging Please, We’re Second Lifers
by prokofy on 29/06/07 at 1:58 am
By Prokofy Neva, Harry Bridges Memorial Dept., Smith Act, Inc.
You know how when you go to play a game, this TOS drops down in front of you? You know, the screen that says “I agree” or “I disagree” in Second Life — the rules that you must obey or you can’t enter the world. They contain many complicated, vague, sometimes even contradictory things, but you want to get playing the game or you need to get into the virtual space to run your business or socialize, so you click “yes,” even though you’re not happy. You’re not happy, but hey, that’s how it is. It’s their game. It’s their servers. They can do what they want.
But imagine if you had a drop-down TOS like that in real life. That wouldn’t be right, would it? In real life, laws like that get made with more responsible and accountable people in charge, usually — don’t they? And you’ve never had an agreement to sign like that before you went to a conference, to speak at a workshop, or to record the sessions or photograph the participants, have you?
Well, welcome to the oppressive and chilling future inklings of the Metaverse that Second Life and its fetid fetid ones always provide for us. The Zhdanovites at the SLCC OrgKomitet have now posted “SLCC Community Standards” — like the sort of CS you sign on to when you log on, but not half as well-written, and not a third as intelligently interpreted as we get from Daniel Linden. Don’t like it? Refund your reg fee by July 13.
In a post at the notorious free-for-all forums Second Citizen (which, BTW, has no rules even remotely resembling these ones their leaders have posted for this real-life conference!), Jennyfur Peregrine has nonchalantly indicated that anyone who goes to SLCC will have to commit to abiding by these rules — or face removal. That means you cannot videotape or record any sessions — exclusive total broadcasting rights are granted to only one SL media company, Phreak Radio (the “fair use” of other broadcasters isn’t made clear). That means you cannot speak for more than 1-2 minutes when you ask a question. That means you cannot “harass” anyone else — a concept that is as capacious as the ever-growing grid of SL itself. Read the rules here and my analysis here in this thread.
Let’s hope Linden Lab, MillionsofUs, RiversRunRed, Infinite Vision Media, Useful Technology, NMC Virtual Worlds, Anshe Chung Studios, OnRez, and the other sponsors of SLCC get a serious grip on the implications of turning real life into a game ruled by game-gods, and urge the organizers to drop these ill-conceived organizer-made restrictions in favour of media self-governance.
Yomama Saidsoe
Jun 29th, 2007
If you go – just behave yourself fer chrissakes.
The way I see it there was a reason for those rules to be written…
The reason is most likely that you guys act like a bunch of miscreant middle school kids in a freakin’ parking lot who are likely to get plastered on their parent’s cheap booze and turn the place into another one of your screaming baby forum food-fights.
Personally, I’m embarrassed for you. I just hope nobody I know realizes that I spend time with a group like this.
Get a grip, have fun and try not to act like an asshole in public or you’ll embarass everybody who loves SL for what it is.
Chris Senior
Jun 29th, 2007
Prokofy, console yourself with the fact that this SLCC thing sounds about as exciting as counting holes in the ceiling tile. I’m not going to this function because I don’t want to spend hard earned $$$ to be bored to tears.
Anonymous
Jun 29th, 2007
So glad you said that, Ugh. The “dearie” thing is getting really annoying.
coco
Ordinal Malaprop
Jun 29th, 2007
I have seen conferences with media restrictions (thus those are not out of the ordinary – though they may be unwise given that a lot of people who may wish to go will be independent broadcasters, and not be keen on the idea of one company being given full rights over everything, and may have booked and more importantly bought ‘plane tickets on that basis). I have never visited a conference with a “behaviour” clause, and I doubt I would as that seems like a very bad sign to me, but apparently they do exist based on above links.
I have never seen a conference which tries to make out that the rules they make up are “community standards”, and that there is an “agreement”. They are not “community standards”; they are not decided by the community. There is no “agreement”, either. They are just a set of rules. I object to the idea that anyone thinks that they can define the opinions of some “community” based on their own commercial considerations and vague moral codes.
It is all very “keeping SL safe, together”, really. If the organisers want to put rules into place, fine, say “we run this conference and we are setting these rules”, but they are nothing more than that, they are not agreed community standards.
(I have never seen one which sets a specific time limit on responses, by the way. I personally would have fallen foul of that, just trying to explain the errors in a presenter’s code. If that is a rule that is meant to be broken at times it simply should not have been made.)
Reality
Jun 29th, 2007
That, coco, is reserved only for certain people … and is meant to grate on the nerves.
Allana Dion
Jun 29th, 2007
Somebody get a pacifier, I hear babies crying.
Prokofy Neva
Jun 29th, 2007
>The reason is most likely that you guys act like a bunch of miscreant middle school kids in a freakin’ parking lot who are likely to get plastered on their parent’s cheap booze and turn the place into another one of your screaming baby forum food-fights.
>Somebody get a pacifier, I hear babies crying.
Yes, these all go together. These people running SLCC at the “feted core” are all the sort of frat-boy heavy boozer types and they all do stuff like get shit-faced and crawl around and behave badly, shooting pictures of themselves doing stuff like pretending to suck dick — being a heterosexual male — it’s got that sort of um high cultural gloss to it.
I was never more embarassed for somebody than when I saw Flipper at SLCC1 roaringly drunk sing a bawdy song at the top of his lungs to the tune of “These are a Few of My Favourite Things” that had gross lines about the teen grid that made Philip wince (and the rest of us).
So the babies are the core of organizers and their friends, insecure, insular, neuralgic, fussy, colicky about criticism of themselves and their dubious achivements.
Melissa Yeuxdoux
Jun 29th, 2007
“Good work! Now…go back…scroll back…and find what people said BEFORE that to me FIRST. There’s a good girl! TIA!”
Hmmm… who was it who was going on interminably about the Golden Rule recently?
Nacon
Jun 29th, 2007
“>Prok said “I don’t particularly care for you, and were I the type of person who would hold a grudge, I might also consider dropping by and screaming jibberish at you until you banned me
You’ve mixed up the taglines on this one.”
That’s your own words, Prok. It’s a quote from about a year ago.
Look to your right, there’s a link called “Archive Pages”.
Go look it up, I could go find it again but I’m too lazy to re-read a shit ton of crap.
OH OH btw… found two more parts of your history behavior…
Prok said “…do stuff like get shit-faced and crawl around and behave badly, shooting pictures of themselves doing stuff like pretending to suck dick — being a heterosexual male — it’s got that sort of um high cultural gloss to it.”
Prok said “So the babies are the core of organizers and their friends, insecure, insular, neuralgic, fussy, colicky about criticism of themselves and their dubious achivements.”
Keep posting, Prok.
Prokofy Neva
Jun 30th, 2007
Nacon, um, Google is your best friend, sometimes! The comment about “jibberish” wasn’t said by me, but by Kamilion Schnook. The post is here in the comments:
http://www.secondlifeherald.com/slh/2007/01/inside_the_bot_.html
Prokofy Neva
Jun 30th, 2007
>Hmmm… who was it who was going on interminably about the Golden Rule recently?
Did you come to the wrong address with your homily for the day, hon?
Artemis Fate
Jun 30th, 2007
Seems to me that these rules are fair and reasonable, and are all about consideration, something that should have been unwritten law (like not harassing people or not hogging up time in panels with long rants *coughprokofycough*), but since CERTAIN psychotic idiots seem to think that they have the full right to harass and rant up all the time they want, I suppose they had to put these down so if you DID despite all moanings and bitchings about never showing up to SLCC like you NEVER show up to Second Citizen forums, that if you came and decided to harass some more, they’d have some actual cause, reason, and proof to ban you with.
Prokofy, as usual, is only bitching because these rules don’t specifically help his interests needs, which of course is to rant, rave and harass anyone who believes differently than his twisted hateful world-view.
It occurs to me Prokofy , that you are like Don Quixote (which would make Coco Sancho Panza then), thinking you’re fighting evil giants, when everyone else sees a screaming loon attacking a windmill.
Prokofy Neva
Jun 30th, 2007
>It occurs to me Prokofy , that you are like Don Quixote (which would make Coco Sancho Panza then), thinking you’re fighting evil giants, when everyone else sees a screaming loon attacking a windmill.
Are you male or female in real life?
DF
Jun 30th, 2007
Earlier, Prok, you gave a very good few examples of all the different communities in SL. And there’s lots and lots more….
Now, consider a few of each and every little community attending this convention. Couple of each easily fills it.
Do you really want all of them, sometimes clashing and often hating eachother, all those different communities all together there, without a single rule that will give Security some leverage in kicking them out?
Get real.
Mercs and AN, PN and furries, rival designers, PETA members and the lovers of fur coats… You and everyone else? Okay maybe the last three examples nothing more then a little namecalling will happen, but I wouldn’t wanna be there.
I wouldn’t even wanna be an an anime convention or something without rules.
Yes, sales and buisness conventions and the likes, will need little rules, but come on. This is not a sales convention, this is an SL convention. And since SL is filled for the most part with retards, assholes and then a few decent people here and there,I’m pretty sure you’ll see all of them there.
Prokofy Neva
Jun 30th, 2007
>Do you really want all of them, sometimes clashing and often hating eachother, all those different communities all together there, without a single rule that will give Security some leverage in kicking them out
Those rules were already made over the course of thousands of years in this thing called “Real Life”.
The state of Illinois, the city of Chicago have criminal codes and local ordnances that cover things like “disturbing the peace”. The Hilton will also likely have some guidelines on what to do with patrons that are violent while intoxicated.
That’s all you need. You don’t make up stuff about one minute to ask a question and no taping of workshops that you paid to come here. All of that is hugely retarded.
Nina A
Jun 30th, 2007
At least this demonstrates what Prokofy has being saying all along about some SLers being self important nobodies trying to enforce their slipping authority in their own little kingdoms. The no photographing clause is beyond belief. You people that agree with this just to spite the common enemy, *gasp* Prokofy, deserve each other.
Csven Concord
Jun 30th, 2007
Uh oh.
Prok just said on the other thread she’s been oh-so-busy working for some m_a_j_o_r publisher and that’s why she could reply to that thread in a timely fashion (and here I thought she was trying to sneak in a final, worthless comment). Yet look at all the posts attributed to “Prokofy Neva” on this thread… when she was supposedly busy.
Has Prokofy, like a worm, asexually reproduced and there are now… *gasp*… TWO of them? Is Prokofy a virus? the coming global epidemic?!? GOD HELP US ALL!
…
Oh wait. There’s a reasonable explanation. The m_a_j_o_r publisher wants Prok to translate the rules for the SLCC. Silly me.
Artemis Fate
Jun 30th, 2007
Prok>> “>It occurs to me Prokofy , that you are like Don Quixote (which would make Coco Sancho Panza then), thinking you’re fighting evil giants, when everyone else sees a screaming loon attacking a windmill.
Are you male or female in real life?”
I’ll take that response as “That analogy is dead on, I have nothing to say, so instead i’ll once again dip into my own hypocrisy for solace and hope it makes me look better”. Nice try, Quixote.
“At least this demonstrates what Prokofy has being saying all along about some SLers being self important nobodies trying to enforce their slipping authority in their own little kingdoms. The no photographing clause is beyond belief. You people that agree with this just to spite the common enemy, *gasp* Prokofy, deserve each other.”
Next time, before you make negative statements about the people who run SLCC, get your facts straight. Nowhere in the community standards does it say “NO PHOTOGRAPHY”, it says “try to get permission before taking a photograph or video.”, it doesn’t even say “don’t” it just says “try to” which basically just means “be kind and considerate and please try not to do this”, not that “if we see you take a picture of ANYONE for ANY REASON we’re throwing your ass out on the street.” They even stuck this in there: “ADDENDUM: this is not meant to restrict photography in any way. Just be mindful that some people do not like having their picture taken.” Which is funny, because until it became useful as a debating platform, Prokofy was one of those people who bitched and whined about his picture and video being taken at the first SLCC. It wouldn’t be hard to dig up a thread where he complained about it, but then it never is hard to expose Prokofy’s rampant hypocrisies, not even worth it to bother.
Jorus Xi
Jun 30th, 2007
Sigh…
Link to one conference with rules. K.
http://www.dragoncon.org/policies.php
But wait, thats just a bunch of dorks. Okiedokie, how about the National Organization for Women?
http://www.now.org/organization/conference/2005/conference-rules.html
How about the 2002 proposed conference rules for the American Dental Assistants conference.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0MKX/is_3_71/ai_93204937
You may now take away the word “Journalist” when talking about yourself. I found all of these by simply typing “Conference Rules” into that google thing that tells you where nifty stuff is. Investigatamive reporting is hard.
Prokofy Neva
Jun 30th, 2007
>Link to one conference with rules. K.
http://www.dragoncon.org/policies.php
Silly MMORPEGs, anybody?
>But wait, thats just a bunch of dorks. Okiedokie, how about the National Organization for Women?
>http://www.now.org/organization/conference/2005/conference-rules.html
*Bursts out laughing* You seem to think that my article is advocating “having no rules*. But sure, there can be rules — if people are part of making them from the get-go. And look at the NOW rules *closedly*. There isn’t anything like THOSE idiotic rules that the sullent Jenny-fur, her fatuous frat-boy hubbie Flip, and their gal pal Jeska Linden made.
Example, here’s what they say about press: “”Press” shall be defined as persons who may report on the Conference to the public through any media other than NOW publications or platforms.”
They don’t say “You can’t tape the sessions”. They say you CAN report.
Furthermore, they have elaborate procedures and invoke Roberts Rules of Order — great! — but they have no time limit on interventions and motions from the floor. Indeed, if anybody wanted to make rules like that, you can see from this old, organized, efficient group that they have a PROCESS and it is a DEMOCRATIC ONE for making rules.
I don’t see anything vague like “no harassment”.
So invoke rules all you like — the issue isn’t rules. It’s process, how they get made, and the outcome. And the NOW rules are NOTHING LIKE Jenny-fur’s Fatwahs.
And…How about *this*?
http://www.yearlykosconvention.org/register
What could get more democratic than these radicals of the Democratic Party? Yet…I see nothing resembling Jennyfurian Fatwahs there.
No, very lame attempt — and more illustrative of my point than I could have ever wished!
>How about the 2002 proposed conference rules for the American Dental Assistants conference.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0MKX/is_3_71/ai_93204937
Comedy Gold!
>You may now take away the word “Journalist” when talking about yourself. I found all of these by simply typing “Conference Rules” into that google thing that tells you where nifty stuff is. Investigatamive reporting is hard.
I think I can now award myself a Pulitzer for investigative reporting, in fact, but it was just too easy.
Kids today! Don’t they teach civics in the schools anymore???
Anonymous
Jun 30th, 2007
Artemis, Coco is – Coco. I’m not defined by my relationship to someone who happens to be a friend of mine in online games, any more than I am defined by my relationship to you.
If you can’t stand it when people agree with others you don’t like, I suggest you learn to suck it up like an actual grown-up, instead of indulging in shallow and childish thinking.
coco
Artemis Fate
Jun 30th, 2007
“I think I can now award myself a Pulitzer for investigative reporting, in fact, but it was just too easy.”
Ahahahahahahahahahahaha Damn, Quixote, you really are out there! But, i’m sure the nice men in white coats at the asylum do tell you that giving yourself a gold star for doing something you feel is good to help your self-esteem, but that’s going a bit far. You do know, that the Pulitzer is for _journalists_ only right? Not psychotic ranting op-ed blog writers, otherwise you’d be in close competition with all those other nuts at the street corners. I wonder who WOULD win in that sort of Bizarro-Pulitzer award, the crazy hobo with his “the aliens are eating our brains!” rant, the psycho street minister with “Jesus hates gays!” rant, or Prokofy Neva with “THE FIC ARE OUT TO GET ME!!!!!11″ rant.
Thanks for a good laugh though
Jennyfur
Jul 1st, 2007
LMAO @ “Jennyfurian Fatwahs” that may be the funniest fucking thing I have EVER heard in my entire life. Seriously…
Prokofy Neva
Jul 1st, 2007
yes, funny like a crutch! And I’m glad you got some help understanding what “fatwah” means, Jennyfur!
Csven Concord
Jul 2nd, 2007
I think Prokofy wants the last word, Jennyfur.
I wonder how many threads on SLH she’s obsessively chased the last word. Sounds like an opportunity to me.
Anonymous
Jul 2nd, 2007
Well, you actually managed to have the last word there, didn’t you, Csven?
Cept now it’s MINE muahahahahahaha!
coco
Lil Fitz
Jul 2nd, 2007
Hi coco. You seen my mommy? We haven’t seen her in days. Please help us. We’re hungry and she spends all her time locked in her room with the computer.
Anonymous
Jul 2nd, 2007
My children aren’t home right now. One is in college, engaged, and in her own apartment, and the other, who is 17, is visiting her friend.
(And when they are home, I don’t just stand around at the ready like a sentry for the moment they might need me. They’re perfectly capable of coming to me at the computer if I’m there, playing or working, or if I’m cooking – you name it.)
But since we’re chatting about children, how many do you have?
coco