SL SHOCK — Counterfeit Collar Killer Frees Submissive Slaves!!!
by Alphaville Herald on 18/09/08 at 9:53 pm
Outrage! – Nothing as degrading as a Master Code controlling content creator
by Pixeleen Mistral, Subrealism Affairs desk
An acute reader sent a note to the Herald offices pointing to Marx Dudek’s tale of woe – her beloved Amethyst obedience collar was intentionally broken by the creator Amethyst Rosencrans. A visit to Sensations sim confirmed that the “Sensations Collar Team” had placed scripted objects broadcasting commands on chat channel 1 — commands that kill slave collars scripts.
According to the notecards at the store, this firm but fair discipline on wayward collars became necessary after Linden Lab failed to maintain strict digital rights management over user created content – an unfortunate incident resulting in previously protected collars becoming “fully permissive”. With permissive collars being promiscuously copied and resold, the economic rationale for a vital metaverse lifestyle accessory was in danger – and the Sensations team swung into action to disable older versions of their product.
While collar killing may improve Sensations’ bottom line, the emotional fallout from this business decision should not be underestimated. As silent commands cause pre-6.0 versions of the slave collar to crash, collared and leashed avatars are able to regain total control their own actions, and risk breaking the bond of trust the develops between a collared slave and master – a sordid end to a virtual romance. How many masters will believe their slaves accidentally broke their collars?
[16:37] MystiTool HUD 1.0.23: (Serenity Rosencrans) [Illegal Amethyst Killer - Ch.1]: *ThisIsSomeReallyLongTextThatWillCrashIllegalAmethystCollars! 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1
[16:37] Amethyst Collar [script:Leash Script]: Script run-time error
[16:37] Amethyst Collar [script:Leash Script]: Stack-Heap Collision
Should the Lab step in to protect the consumer?
There have been indications that the Governance Team hopes to expand its charter and may even begin accepting abuse reports for fraud and failure to deliver services in-world. If the Linden game gods decide to meddle in the affairs of the players, intentionally crashed BDSM collars would seem to be an ideal place to establish a precedent.
Who else will protect the players’ collars from the invisible chat commands of the marketplace?
Amethyst Notecard
If your Collar crashed when you arrived, this means you likely have a pre-version 6 collar.
It is evidenced by an error like this:
Amethyst Collar [script:Collar Script]: Script run-time error
Amethyst Collar [script:Collar Script]: Stack-Heap Collision
This is due to a bug in the version 5 (and possibly earlier) command parser. If you are using a version 6 collar this bug does not exist. You need to obtain an upgrade to version 6 to eliminate this problem. This is free for people who have purchased a collar from Sensations.
To obtain an upgrade you must be the person who purchased the collar, and you must send an IM to Amethyst Rosencrans requesting an update to v6. A ticket will be created and someone will contact you regarding the replacement. If you want immediate replacement you can go to the
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 18th, 2008
It is costing us money to support all these illegal collars. Something had to be done. If the Governance Team does step in to do something, I would certainly hope that they would stop the distribution of these illegal items and not against the victim of the problem (us).
mootykips
Sep 19th, 2008
well what an interesting social experiment this will be
RanDom
Sep 19th, 2008
I don’t see how this is an “outrage”. The ways for those with legitimate collars to get this fixed is simple and available. SL refuses to realize that when they incorporated a real world money market into the game, that means that things like this NEED to be dealt with. If you purchased an illegal version and can’t get an upgrade, shoot Amethyst an IM with the creator’s name and let them know. Then buy original. If any business owner was in their place they more than likely would have done the exact same thing.
Good on Amethyst for standing up against both SL’s ways of dealing with things like this, as well as those that have exploited their creations and used them for their own profitable gain. The only outrage should be that people have went as far as stealing and reselling something they obviously didn’t create.
Angel
Sep 19th, 2008
FUCKING HELL AMETHYST.
How many masters buy the collar for their pet, and now, when said pet comes to your store you disable their collar.
Never again will I buy one of your products if you do this low handed dirty filthy trick.
At least put a freaking warning up BEFORE you crash the collars that pets should not proceed without their Masters.
VERY irresponsible.
Alyx Stoklitsky
Sep 19th, 2008
Angel’s rage is humourous to say the least.
Get over yourself, pal. Your e-sluts are hardly going to go running away to their real lives the second their imaginary collar gets coughs up script error.
Corsi Mousehold
Sep 19th, 2008
Simple yet effective quick fix.
Rightclick Edit the collar.
Go up to the Tools drop menu at the top of your screen.
Click Set Scripts to Running in selection
Click Reset scripts in selection
Collar should work again.
pet
Sep 19th, 2008
hahahahaha. Am I the only one who finds this really funny? I’m a pet on SL, but it’s JUST SL, holy crap people. I understand that you feel somehow like you’re really truly owned in this virtual reality, but you aren’t. You can log off at any time, you can create an alt and whore it up with whoever, etc.
There is no way in which you are “really owned.” It’s online, it’s a game, it’s a virtual reality where you still really have control, just not over that one avatar. Oh wait, yes you do, cause you can simply take off the collar and SL mute your master. You do get that a locked collar isn’t really “locked” it just means your “master” gets an email about it. Oh noes! Not an email!
Everybody in collared relationships in SL are roleplaying and taking it THAT seriously might indicate that you need to find a real life master. I promise, it’s not that scary being owned in real life. Then if your master lets you, you can play on SL and be a little less attached to what may or may not happen to your fake collar.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 19th, 2008
@Angel: Not sure how a warning would work, but I originally posted about this problem more than 6 months ago. The sign is quite clear and the versions of the collar that are vulnerable are well over a year old. If you were a legitimate customer then I am sorry to see you go, but I have to do this to save the business and my sanity. If you are using illegal versions which is why you are outraged then I have no sympathy.
Perhaps you should take your rage out on the 50+ people I have found to be distributing or reselling these illegal items. I get reports of people coming into the store and selling them for a bargain price. Then there are people selling them “full perm” on SLX.
I pay Sparrow to provide support to legitimate customers… her time, my time and Earalia’s time are getting consumed handling support requests by people who have received these illegal items. It is the most frustrating thing you can imagine. You start handling a request in good faith and after 5-10 minutes you realize that it is one of the illegal items and you have wasted all that time that could have been spent on making new items, legitimate customers or even doing something fun.
Some of the people who receive them I am sure are people who don’t realize they are illegal, but many of them just lie directly to us. This is a way to bring it to the attention of the unknowing. To pre-emptively identify the illegal items before we waste our time and money.
RanDom
Sep 19th, 2008
I believe the collars auto-update, and that update makes them become broken. So just resetting the script wont do it. I may be wrong, though.
FlipperPA Peregrine
Sep 19th, 2008
BTW… it is really a dude.
fork
Sep 19th, 2008
Better stick a fork in Sensations because when the word gets out that Sensations are secretly assulting the visitors to their stores… Sensations will be DONE… To me there has always been something ‘not quite right’ with that operation. Something foreign. Maybe sinister… There could be a kind of paranormal evil at work. Something elemental that flourishes when a human person opens themselves up to the kind of living those types of products bring on. Beware because its starting to secretly go after visitors to their store who wear the competition’s products apparently…
Anonymous
Sep 19th, 2008
imagine … backdoors in SL gadgets… building in a kill mechanism is a really good idea anytime you make anything … it could get out and wouldn’t be fun to have it used against yourself…
some people may not know they even could get an upgrade, it’s too much reading.
and bad scripting that allows excessively long strings to crash the scripts is just sloppy. on channel 1 no less…
wonder what else will crash if you spew long chat on channel 1….
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 19th, 2008
Yes… we secretly go after our competitors by letting them sell for free in our sim… right next to our own stuff. How evil is that?
happy pet
Sep 19th, 2008
My miss makes sure my collar is up to date. So I have nothing to worry about.
Thank you for making our update so EASY, Amethyst!
I’ve proudly worn an Amethyst collar for like a year, and again, as I said, my Miss always makes sure my gear is up to date.
This is a non-issue for most people. Especially if they have a good Master/Mistress.
Those pets stuck with cheapskate masters/mistresses just find out they’re owned by a cheapskate, isntead of someone who will make sure to get them GOOD equipment.
Again. Thank you Amethyst. I love my collar.
Unpatriotic Honkey
Sep 19th, 2008
For a free fix visit the FREE DOVE store pick up a new free version!
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 19th, 2008
Thank you!
It will be even easier with the new version.
Anonymous
Sep 19th, 2008
so this ought to be interesting … a battle between the developer and someone not skilled enough to make the product in the first place…
Darien Caldwell
Sep 19th, 2008
As a competitor of Amethyst, I hesitate to make any comments about this as people are sure to twist the intent no matter what. But as a person I have to say I’m conflicted about this news. I don’t condone crashing collars in a deliberate manner, however I can see the Amy has been left with few options thanks to LL’s inaction in this matter.
I can only hope there is some breakthough which will turn this situation around for the better interests of all. *Hugs Amethyst*
Marx Dudek
Sep 19th, 2008
I don’t want to give anyone the impression that I was besmirching Sensations as a company, or Amethyst as a creator or Sparrow as a representative – I am still a mostly-satisfied and continuing customer. Sparrow went above and beyond the call in explaining and empathizing.
The collar I have was given to me by a trustworthy friend. We are not in that kind of relationship anymore – she is in a new relationship altogether and I feel conflicted about asking her to take it back from me and exchanging it for me. The important thing to me was that I have become sentimentally attached to it – which is odd, as I realize it’s rendered pixels on a monitor – but I have.
Amethyst mentioned in a response on my blog that a version 7 is in the works. I will wait and get some evaluations on it and consider it.
Amethyst has a great shop with great products and I understand her frustration – but there is frustration to be had on both sides.
Anonymous
Sep 19th, 2008
makes one want to give out a freebie collar buster… wouldn’t that be fun to take to Gor…
oh the anarchy!!
wtf
Sep 19th, 2008
“As silent commands cause pre-6.0 versions of the slave collar to crash, collared and leashed avatars are able to regain total control their own actions, and risk breaking the bond of trust the develops between a collared slave and master – a sordid end to a virtual romance.”
” crash, collared and leashed avatars are able to regain total control their own actions, and risk breaking the bond of trust the develops between a collared slave and master – a sordid end”
“risk breaking the bond of trust the develops between a collared slave and master”
Why in the fuck is a scripted collar the strongest part of a BDSM e-relationship? I understand that a collar is a symbol much like a wedding ring, but the scripts?!? If a script breaks, then the relationship is over? That’s pretty fucking stupid. If there is any real relationship whatsoever, then the slave should willingly follow the master, with no need for a collar to force her to.
That said, all you BDSM fags should die in a fire. This is what you deserve.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 19th, 2008
Thank you Darien *hugs*
A Smart Slave
Sep 19th, 2008
Just for those consumer’s that have broken collars, reset the scripts in the collars. Then change the channel to any other channel (2 and above). The collars will function as before, you just have to reset your Master or Mistress as owner.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 19th, 2008
@Anonymous About the sloppy part… I had checks in for the long strings… but the * at the beginning errantly caused it to skip the checks. It seems to cause crashes in a number of things. I accidentally caused some doors to crash with it.
Amethyst Sucks Anyway
Sep 19th, 2008
What a joke. Amethyst collars all suck anyway. nothing new in them for two years. They’re stale and outdated.
VGS collars blow Amethyst collars away. Amethyst needs to drum-up fresh sale for all the business she’s losing as everyone sees how much better all the other collars are.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 19th, 2008
@ A Smart Slave – The bug happens on any of the channels, I was doing it on channel 1 because it is the default alternate channel and won’t disrupt others since it is a hidden channel.
@ Amethyst Sucks Anyway – Not true but I respect the fact that you think another collar is better. However please don’t disparage with lies.
RanDom
Sep 20th, 2008
You people can’t be this blind…
If you are using a legal version of the collar that just happens to be vulnerable to this bug, our sincerest apologies for the inconvenience. —-Please contact us for a replacement.—-
Yes! Lets go ahead and just act like all they are doing is breaking every single collar and saying a big “screw you” to everyone that has ever bought from them. Lets continue then to forget the reason WHY this happened in the first place, and act as if this was done just to spite the customers. On top of that, lets act as if there is no way AT ALL to get it fixed if you bought one legitimately! Oh, and the cherry on the top…make the collars completely die when someone goes to the store, so it never works again! Aha! Sensations is DONE…if this would be true!
I just feel that alot of these people that are furious have bought the fake collars that have broken and can’t get a replacement. Hell, good on them for leaving a safeguard, as you can see now that it did them good. There was no malice intended at all in what they did, simply just to kill those that were selling their stolen product at “fell off the back of the truck” prices. They have a great product and have a very simple, no hassle solution on getting it fixed if you bought it legit. Contact them, they replace it, you go on with your merry life. If anything, those that got broken collars should NOT take this as an attack on them and realize that this is a way to fix something that exploited their products to begin with, which was caused by forces beyond their control. It sucks, it causes some issues but those issues are not permanent at all for those that bought legit. If you didn’t buy legit, then you should have.
Harriet Tubman
Sep 20th, 2008
Quick my enslaved brethren! Visit Amethyst Rosencrans’ store and break free the chains of your unwilling bondage, I do declare this store to be the first step of the new SL Underground Railroad! Come along! Come along to Freedom from your pimply Fat-ass real life “Mistress”!
-Harriet Tubman
Anonymous
Sep 20th, 2008
oops … the * is being processed as matches anything…
probably happens in a lot of things…..
janeforyou Barbara
Sep 20th, 2008
I been doing business with Amethyst Rosencrans for 2 yares in her SIM and my SIM– Ame are one of the best i ever traded with! The service and kindness Ame providea are awsome!I had never any to complain on there and hundreds of my “sisters” are costumers
A Smart Slave
Sep 20th, 2008
@Amethyst – in order for it to work, though, the chat buf would have to be said in the same channel. And since most of the operations can be done via menu, it make sense to set it change the channel to avoid the bug…like 21872349.
But, like I said, a simple fix, is a script reset.
/me continues her life.
umm derr i am soooo entitled k?
Sep 21st, 2008
What a nice, fascist method of dealing with the problem. “You have to prove your innocence, or else we shut off the device and essentially take away the item you paid us for, and we still keep your money.”
Imagine the outrage if RL manufacturers pulled this.
The clothing manufacturers/designer(s) in RL who made my clothes don’t get to pour bleach on my clothes because someone copied their designs.
Amana doesn’t get to break my refrigerator because some idiot is infringing on one of their patents.
But wait, this is SL and I AM SUPPOSED TO BE OUTRAGED (about something)! WTF was I thinking?!!
Corona
Sep 21st, 2008
makes one want to give out a freebie collar buster… wouldn’t that be fun to take to Gor…
oh the anarchy!!
just for once i have to agree with anon
it is time these women denigrating trash with tiny RL peni leant that enslaving women degrades men too
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 21st, 2008
The point of this is to get people educated. People who are using legal vulnerable collars will find out that they need to upgraded and get their collars exchanged. People who are using illegal collars will find out and hopefully will get legal… by either buying one of mine…. or one of those other fine collars out there made by others.
If you disagree with my solution that is fine, but you clearly can’t empathize with the emotional distress this whole situation gives me. It is very common, just ask the legitimate skin makers who have their hard work ripped off relentlessly. I am trying my best to find a balance between protecting myself and my customers.
Thanks to everyone who supports me! *hugs*
A Smart Slave
Sep 21st, 2008
@Amethyst: Here’s a little education for you. Anything digital can be copied, modified, transferred, stapled, spindled and mutilated. Just ask Sony what happened when they tried this sorta thing with thier CD’s. They got totally slammed.
As for your little lesson; yes, it taught me not to trust you to make a product that is secure. I won’t be buying any v.7 of your collar as I would be fearful that it’ll have some sort of back door to it that’ll render it inoperative. Through your actions to purposely render older versions inoperative, you’ve proven that you aren’t beyond those that would steal your products.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 21st, 2008
@A Smart Slave – I don’t think there is any comparison to what I am doing. It is like someone making illegal copies of software products like Adobe’s Creative Suite and then expecting them to provide support for that product. I cannot afford to provide support for people who use illegal items. It is either do something or go out of business.
There is no support provided for CDs/DVDs/Blu-rays… they copy them and they use them. They are just not getting paid for the material they produced. So Sony is getting hit on one side… the production side. I am getting hit from both sides, I am not getting paid for the production.. and it is costing me money to provide support.
I can tell you I will not put in any back doors. This campaign is intended to help my customers not hurt them, and anyone who suggests that is just being ridiculous.
A Smart Slave
Sep 21st, 2008
@Amethyst: Microsoft doesn’t support Windows 2000 or below. There is a support cutoff for them. And they don’t purposely render thier Windows products inoperative, either, by sending a code through the internet to all illegal copies of Windows to shut them down. Granted, a BDSM collar isn’t as important than, say, your bank statements..but the priciple is the same. Your answer could be simpler than garnering this sort of controversy. Stop supporting collars v5.7 and below, and don’t cripple the ones that are out there.
Stephan Peck
Sep 21st, 2008
This is nothing new. For real world examples of this kind of business at work. One only needs to see how badly Spore got slammed on amazon for DRM.
Treat legit customers like pirates and they just might start to behave like it in backlash
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 21st, 2008
@ A Smart Slave – Microsoft also does not provide a free upgrade from Windows 2000. The message does not disable the collar, just demonstrates a problem to encourage upgrading. So arguably my support is considerably better
@ Stephan Peck – Definitely not going to treat legit customers like pirates, I am trying to protect them. If I have to stop providing support or if I call it quits completely… the legitimate customers will be hurt.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 21st, 2008
@ A Smart Slave – By the way… the plan is to stop supporting 5.7 and older. This campaign is the lead-up to that… this campaign is to get people to upgrade before support gets discontinued in addition to identifying illegal items and where they came from. People are going to be upset no matter what I do… and it is NOT my fault.
The plans of action I had to choose from:
1) Discontinue all support. People will not be happy about not having support.
2) Close down the business. People will not be happy about not having new items or updates to existing items they purchase.
3) Discontinue support for the versions that were exploited and older. This is what I tried to do originally and people were livid… claiming I was doing it to make people rebuy.
4) Allow update with proof of purchase for a period of time until I can phase out as many of the out-of-date items as possible to limit the number of people who will be left supportless after the deadline.
As you can see I picked choice number 4 (although I originally picked 3… but changed to 4).
This campaign is part of the effort to get people up-to-date so I can announce a deadline for support. So you the course of action you suggest is the first one I tried…. it failed with a much bigger backlash than this campaign.
Now perhaps you have more insight into the tough decisions I had to make… I have tried the best I can to find something of a balance.
Stephan Peck
Sep 21st, 2008
“@ Stephan Peck – Definitely not going to treat legit customers like pirates, I am trying to protect them. If I have to stop providing support or if I call it quits completely… the legitimate customers will be hurt.”
And im very sure the execs at EA feel the exact same way. That dose little to change the over all results.
A Smart Slave
Sep 21st, 2008
@Amethyst, Microsoft also doesn’t intentionally cause computers to crash when visiting Windows Update, unlike you do with your product when one visits your sim with any collar v5.7 or older. Another course of action could be that you could offer collars v5.7 as freebies, with the understanding that no support is inherent. That way, those that sell the illegal copies aren’t profiting from you, because, now it’s not a loss and you come out looking like the good guy, instead of a greedy business woman that all this publicity is making you look like now. Just make sure that v7.0 is well worth the purchase of said collar.
kittyn fuhr
Sep 22nd, 2008
I do not know if this is the same thing…but was very distressing to me this week.
On Wednesday morning, I tried on an outfit. It knocked off my collar…which ended up missing. Master got the comment that it was removed….but it never returned to my inventory. I tried clearing my cache, and restarting…
the next day, we went and bought new Amethyst scripts, new ToKon hud, and placed them into another collar that i took from one of my alts (both of these collars were Ephemeral collars). This was wednesday night…thursday morning, I set it up….Sunday afternoon, I change into my dragon form…about an hour or two later, I go back to wear it….and it was missing. Again, I tried to clear cache, and find it…2 times in one week…it really distressed me.
I contacted concierge support, who found it, and returned it somehow to my inventory. Both of them.
I was worried, if something had happened, since they both had Amethyst, and were both ephemeral collars….then my friend sent this to me. So…i don’t know if this is related or not…but, for those who said it was just pixels…i kept trying to tell myself that, also. But it was a gift. Something that shows a bond…it would be the same if the wedding rings in RL were lost (except for less cost, of course)….they can be replaced. It’s the meaning. Now…I know hopefully it won’t happen again, and can fix it if it does….hopefully.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 22nd, 2008
@ A Smart Slave – I can’t say for sure, but I used to have a computer that ran Windows, and I am not entirely convinced that Microsoft didn’t cause Windows to crash.
I already give away a lot of stuff that my competition use to compete against me and I let my competitors sell in my sim against me for free. I just don’t see how anyone can think I am doing it for “greed.” I don’t want people using those old collars… there is a major bug in them… it would be irresponsible to distribute them with knowledge of that.
@ kittyn fuhr – There is a bug in SL that causes them to go missing. If you don’t have concierge support to recover them, then we do complimentary replacement with proof of purchase.
Angel
Sep 23rd, 2008
Well Amethyst, so that you can see how many of your products I have purchased over the last 2 years I will IM you in game, you will see I am definately legal.
My gripe is that you should have a sign at the landing zone “Do not proceed if you wear a V5 collar, or only proceed with your Master… then 21M in have your crasher”
As you now have it, as soon as the unknowing pet TPs into the sim they will be fucked over.
The people I have passed this information onto have also not been able to believe that you would betray valid customers trust in this way.
Amethyst Rosencrans
Sep 23rd, 2008
@Angel – I have tried to do things like that in the past. It does not work. It is a minor inconvenience now to prevent a huge one later. I would characterize that as doing the customers a favor.
Earalia Nolan
Sep 28th, 2008
On December 10th, 2007 collar version 6.0 was released. This collar couldn’t be updated from the earlier versions, which was meant to block people with full right collars from updating higher versions. I had a discussion about this with Amethyst, feeling it was a bit to harsh in legit customers, so we opened up doing live manual updates for everyone.
The policy of manual updates has gone on for almost a year now, and taken up about 33% of my time in SL this year (keep in mind I work in the game full-time.) Today it’s at about 1% of my time I would say, so clearly a majority of legit collars have been weeded out. I stepped up to do this because I knew it was important to not hurt our paying customers who were being mixed up in all of this. My view was it was a good move to have manual updates for legit customers since it made things more personable, and I was online all the time anyways.
Eventually I was getting overwhelmed with doing updates all day so Amethyst hired on Sparrow to help out with updates. Manual collar updates still go on, but they are rare to the point where a majority of requests are from pirates. We have an entire database on our servers of our customers sales that we check up on requests so we usually know your entire history seconds after you first instant message us. We just look up the name, confirm it, and send a new one.
Once we give you a new update you don’t have to worry about manual updates again. I’d like to add that we do manual updates for cuffs too, but that’s pretty much needed because all cuff sets have 8 in a set, not 4 like there was originally.
Today a majority of people who own an Amethyst Collar pre-version 6.0 have the pirated. Pirated collars are commonly sold in our own store and given out freely in Gorean sims. We’ve found them in reseller store, SLExchange.com, you name it. It’s come to the point where I’ve walked through my own store and two people approached me within 10 minutes and have offered me to purchase a full rights Amethyst Collar at a discount. Can you imagine that? I’m telling you, please have faith in us. We aren’t Evil (and I’m a succubus!), and we aren’t pulling a Sony.
If you are a legitimate customer with us you shouldn’t have any fear of anything. I’ve have had people unhappy with the policies, but just talk to me (Earalia Nolan) and I’ll will do my best to make things right for you. I can’t think of many people who I wouldn’t leave unhappy. If you have an issue that comes up we will address it as soon as possible, answer your questions to the best of our abilities, and treat you better than anyone else will.
Raven
Jul 12th, 2009
you are alll soo funny first offSecondlife Is a GAME a 3d Virtual world meant to socialize in be creative and have fun in.99% of the so called doms and subs in secondlife have never been a sub or dom in rlc and have no clue what it is really about to begin with..To sit around moaning and having a tantrum about a virtual sub dom realtionship is just silly..Because if you sit down and think about it it isbn’t really a relationship if you don’t know everything about each other never met in rl or hang out in rl for all you know your perfect masters or subs could be married in rl and or better yet could be the same gender as you and you wouldn’t know..Voice doesn’t prove a thing when there is a device that can make you sound like the oposite sex.Geez people get a tissue wipe ur eyes and get over it.