The MegaPrim Spite Fence of Bear Sim
by Alphaville Herald on 28/11/08 at 5:46 pm
Why is LL powerless to remove “friendly greetings” left by Torley Linden’s wife Ravenelle?
by Pixeleen Mistral, National Affairs desk
Linden wife and contractor Ravenelle’s megaprim wall blocks the Bear InfoHub view of one resident’s business
When you teleport to the Bear sim InfoHub, you won’t see Lias Leandros’s business – it is hidden behind a 40 meter tall virtual spite fence created by Ravenelle Zugzwang and located on Linden property. While these sorts of fences are a reasonably common symptom of resident disputes in some neighborhoods, it is unusual to see Linden Lab’s land being used for visual blockades. However, with game gods all things are possible, and Ravenelle Zugzwang has a special relationship with part of the Lab — she is married to Torley Linden. This suggests Ravenelle has a nearly infinite capacity to tolerate Torley chirping, “Friendly greetings!”. Could this be what pushed Ravenelle into a visual smack at Lias Leandros business?
According to an account published by Ms. Leandros here, the virtual fence appeared about a year ago, after repeated abuse reports by Ms. Leandros against the Bear InfoHub for unfair use of sim resources. With a capacity of 40 avatars on the sim, and a large group of regulars that park at the InfoHub, the sim lags and sometimes fills to capacity making it difficult or impossible for Ms. Leandros to run her DJ and club employee training school business.
After a long running campaign of abuse reports and complaints to the Abuse Report Team, the Community Team, and the Linden Concierge, Ms. Leandros was eventually offered the option of tearing down her buildings and moving to another sim – an offer she declined. Within days, Ravenelle Zugzwang has erected her 40 meter wall on Linden-owned land, sending a not so subtle message — it’s good to be married to the Lab, and tier paying customers can like it or leave.
Presumably this sort of message will go down well with the education and corporate clients the Lab is now courting – assuming they can get someone to marry into the Linden family to get inside information and special treatment. Run of the mill players will have to get used to surprise 66% land price increases – but look on the bright side – as the Lab hires staff, the pool of potential marriage partners grows!
looking east from the Bear InfoHub – nothing but wall
According to her account, Ms. Leandros has been a resident of Bear sim since 2005, and in 2006 was approached by Torley Linden who “asked me did I want a Infohub for new players to rez and explore I said yes. He chose the builder because I was fairly new and could not build. The build was completed and sat there for some time. New players occasionally rezzed, wandered and moved on.”
Ravenelle built the wall – and is married to Torley Olmsted – a Torley Linden alt
Torley Olmsted’s profile with signature watermelon color scheme
An inspection of Torley and Ravenelle’s profiles and web sites suggests that there is something more than a business-like, arm’s length relationship between the two, and in most normal companies this sort of nepotism might be frowned upon. But Linden Lab is not a normal company. Is this sort of conflict of interest combined with antagonizing a paying customer an problem for the Lab’s new leadership? Perhaps not – and this behaviour is consistent with the practical Tao of the Lindens – a heady combination of hubris, indifference to customers, and heroic Koolade consumption.
Linden land – under Torley and Ravenelle’s control
Build access to Linden land and the tools Ravenelle needs to be creative – inspire a loving video tribute to husband Torley
Ms. Leandros’ account continues, “In 2007 Linden Lab changed the definition of the infohub and encouraged mass unsupervised gathering there. So now a sim that can only hold 40 avatars at once mostly supports the infohub loiterers (not just new players now, but mostly older, established accounts that like to greif and stand in the infohub). I pay $125 USD a month in tier to use the sim resources in Bear and cannot even hold a class for five avatars in my DJ school. My money goes to support Linden Lab’s parking lot.”
Unfortunately for Ms. Leandros, while conventional wisdom suggests that Cesear’s wife should be above reproach, this does not seem to be necessary in the autocratic land of Linden, where a close personal relationship the right people may be all you need to step on your enemies – or critics.
Ms. Leandros’ property protests gross abuse
Lias is a C-Nt
Nov 28th, 2008
Ever thought about the real way this happened?
Lias is a cunt who has been harassing and abusing newbies for years now. That’s the only reason for such a screen to exist. She’s a parasite and her build a festering wound in the grid.
LOL
Nov 28th, 2008
Mega Prim walls like this plauge the mainland. if LL removes 1 then everone would REPORT ABUSE for ever MegaPrim wall over 11 Meters. thats why they do not do SHIT to stop or prevent em
Mariposa
Nov 28th, 2008
Why didn’t she move? It’s not as if moving in SL is truly difficult. She could be holding her classes now.
Maggie Darwin
Nov 28th, 2008
While I wouldn’t want to live next to an infohub, I wouldn’t want to live next to Lias’s place either. Maybe you should have published a picture of what that looks like as a whole, rather than a close-up of one sign.
Depp
Nov 28th, 2008
hello,
about 1 year ago, i owned 1/4 sim in gealain, the neighbor sim to bear. i also owned a parcel in bear sim, next to my parcel-border.
as i sold this small parcel in bear to someone, lias started to build a huge prim wall against this new owner and my parcel.
it was never happen before in this region! i asked lias why she/he did this and the answer was, i should have sold the parcel to her/him.
the parcel was about 6 weeks flagged as for sell to everybody! anyway, lias begun to call me names….odd story.
after a 3 month complaining and discuss, me and all my project members flee to a private sim.
lias is not a victim….but rather a very strange person.
depp
Anonymous
Nov 28th, 2008
Amazing… All this fuss over what? That god aweful failure that LL calls the mainland? All this fuss over cleaning it up, making it a more attractive product. I attended Jack Linden’s office hour on Thanksgiving and that’s all they talked about. Adding more regulations and restrictions to stop some stupid thing called “Doughnut Holes” where morons are going around selling 512 plots with a chunk cut out in the middle.
The whole thing is just so amazingly stupid it makes my head hurt! You want to make the mainland look better? Simple solution idiots! Teach your users some design skills! Show them that throwing up four blocks with a triangle on top and then slapping on a cartoonish library texture for a house is not acceptable!
And what about making the mainland oh, maybe a bit more usable? Make it so that you don’t walk three meters only to be thrown back like you’ve run into a rubber band? Maybe even fix it so that when you rez into your lovely little mainland home that you don’t have to wait 20 god damn minutes for the f**king sim to rez?
Before I lost my openspace I never even bothered to set foot on the mainland in over a year. There was no point as there’s little to no good content over there, and even if there was I was unwilling to stand there for a half an hour just to wait for it to load. By now the whole of SL has become so utterly useless for me that I only use it as an instant messaging tool to talk to my friends in world. At that I don’t even bother logging in with a normal client anymore. I just log in using a text based client like MetaBolt and camp out in -oops- and infohub while my now non-paying avi sits there and sucks up sim resources.
Reverse Writer
Nov 28th, 2008
“making it difficult or impossible for Ms. Leandros to run her DJ and club employee training school business.”
hahahaha, really? What does she teach them? How to be a gesturetard? How to beg for tips?
Anonymous
Nov 29th, 2008
Lindens abuse their powers in a small controlled world.
Next at six, grass is green, the sky is blue. Shocking news.
Alyx Stoklitsky
Nov 29th, 2008
cool megaprim usage bro.
Margrett
Nov 29th, 2008
Oddly not one of Lias’ tier paying customers have ever complained about any of her builds. This old sim seemed to be drama free until Linden Lab broke it’s agreement with the residents in Bear and began promoting the infohub as a mass gathering place. I must point out that since this article was published LL uped the avatar count of Bear sim to a unprecedented 50. They did this quietly without informing anyone. Which, of course just makes it impossible to move in the sim.
Sadly, the only people Linden Lab’s spitewall effects are the three tier payers that own land around the infohub. Lias’ school has paying customers (even if they cannot enter the classroom in the sim due to lag and infohub loitering) and her live DJ club has spurts of activity during her few events.
This take-no-prisoners attack of all of the Bear residents by the service provider is just amazing. It stands as an cautionary tale to anyone who is planning to buy mainland and become a premium account. Beware.
The consultant reviewing the infohubs and sending their recommendations to LL has just recently concluded the Bear Infohub is less than necessary and should be removed/relocated. So blame this guy and move it and be done with this nonsense.
CC Columbo
Nov 29th, 2008
“According to an account published by Ms. Leandros here, the virtual fence appeared about a year ago, …” The Bear Infohub has been my Home spot for nearly 6 months so I know that this statement is false. An Inspection (right-click the object then keep choosing ‘More’ until you can ‘Inspect’) of the object shows it’s creation date at November 20, 2008. At no time has the area been so busy I could not log-in at Home or teleport there.
Regarding the article: At no point does it indicate the author tried to contact Ravenelle, Torley, or any Linden for comment. I grow increasingly disappointed with the Herald and it’s lack of journalistic standards. It is becoming a supermarket checkout tabloid.
Spock
Nov 29th, 2008
Don’t like it?
RENT ON AN ESTATE!
Problem solved.
Margrett
Nov 29th, 2008
“Regarding the article: At no point does it indicate the author tried to contact Ravenelle, Torley, or any Linden for comment.” What would these parties say if contacted? The wall is in Ravenelle’s name, The group that allowed her to rez it is Torley’s. The Land is under control of Linden Lab. In Lias’ blog you see the Department of Public Works (michael Linden) was notified, Katt Linden (marketing) was notified, Torley was notified via his blog, Ravenelle was notified (and rezzed more walls upon notification. Pay attention. The facts are staring you in the face. In order to harass Lias, Linden Lab has allowed this resident to block the business’ of everyone that pays tier in that sim. It is sad testimonial to Linden Lab’s lack of professionalism and common sense.
Martin
Nov 29th, 2008
A month ago I would have been suspicious of the nepotism charge. But now that I’ve seen it myself — in the use of vigilante “police groups” who openly bully citizens — I have no doubt that certain employees go 180 degrees against “The Tao of Linden” clause “No Politics!” (“Never act to advance your own interests or someone else’s interests at the expense of the interests of the company. This is the one principle, outside of violations of law, for which violation will likely result in immediate termination.”)
Clearly this allegedly pivotal principle is not enforced.
Two Worlds
Nov 29th, 2008
Wait…Torley’s a GUY?!
Wait…Torley’s MARRIED?!
Wait…Torley’s STRAIGHT?!
Haha, I love that “Bounce for Autism”. Sorta like “Spaz Out and Flail About Wildly While Gibbering Incoherently for Aspergers Syndrome”
CC Columbo
Nov 29th, 2008
“What would these parties say if contacted?” The point was not about the reasoning behind the object placement, but rather about being fair. A lack of effort to contact all parties shows bias. If intentional, that is bad journalism. Is the Herald a new source or an opinion blog? If it is the latter, a lack of balance is more acceptable, though reflects on the quality of the reporting. Wouldn’t all the fuss be wasted if it is part of a theme change or other rebuilding. No mention is made in either the Herald piece or the original blog of the other recent additions such as whimsical mushrooms, stacks of pancakes, and other items. Even simple curiosity might lead one to ask questions.
If you are at all interested, I like the area the way it was a month ago. The prim curtain is irritating and the new items are completely out of theme. Then again, I don’t like any of the builds behind the Bear Infohub, either. But if I want to keep it as my Home spot I will need to adjust. Otherwise, I can move.
80-percent-garbage
Nov 29th, 2008
I won’t even visit any place on the main areas they keep due to the lag and garbage builds. If it’s not a private sim, I don’t go there. If it takes more than a few minutes to load, I am gone. Thus I hardly spend what I used to in SL. The only sims that seem to load within any respectable time is single private. And some of those don’t load up quickly or all the way as well.
On main regions Linden has, you are either bumping into red ban lines or large prims. TOS should ban both and require removal unless you have your own simulator and pay real good for screwing up the peoples experience. Now there is the needed change.
People paying the money seem to be encouraged to produce something worth viewing.
Margrett
Nov 29th, 2008
UPDATE: The Lindens snuck in yesterday and increased the avavar limit in Bear to 50. And by 3PM today the sim was unaccessible because of 37 avatars in the infohub (and several waiting in chief sim to get in and ‘chat’) The more avatars allowed in – the more will loiter and make the sim useless. Let the battle between customer and service provider continue.
Orion Shamroy
Nov 29th, 2008
I popped over there last night to see what all the hubub was about. Why they would put that wall up is a complete mystery to me. On one side you have a tree texture, the other is 100% transparent. So in other words you can see into the hub but not out. The only thing that seems to have caused is confusion among the new residents coming into that area. For example, an interesting conversation I had with a first day newbie while I was there (Names withheld to save my ass from being TOSed):
Newbie: hey! where did you come from!
Orion: Umm, I just walked in over the bridge?
Newbie: hwo?/ there’s a wall there! the bridge goes nowhere!
Orion: Well, there’s other stuff on the other side of that wall. Its phantom.
Newbie: what? it a ghost?
Orion: No phantom means you can walk through it.
Newbie: **no response, friend request received as she walks through the wall then disappears off into the oblivion of the mainland**
Gee, and last I remember Torley and his bunch were all about improving the new user’s experience? Not befuddling them by blocking off paths to the rest of second life and the beloved mainland they’re trying so hard fix?
Jumbo
Nov 29th, 2008
You know, I only have 1 thing to say about all of this: WHO CARES????
All you guys with your panties bunched up need to do a couple of things. Go outside, look at the sun, take a breath of fresh air and get laid.
No, not masturbating with some cartoon woman in SL who is the same overweight middle-aged man as you are. But a real woman.
You know, all this stupid piddling drama about virtual land and money and crap looks pretty ridiculous in that blissful post-coital haze (do you guys even remember or know what that is??).
LOL
Nov 30th, 2008
JUMBO YOU ROCK! MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY!
GET A REAL LIFE!
Margrett
Nov 30th, 2008
What a few of you are finding hard to understand is that this i snot about being to immersed in a fantasy world. It is about paying for server space and not getting it. Your too immersed in the fantasy of Second Life if you pretend this is about community, cybering space or personalities. Linden Lab is a service company. They can either provide the service or fix the problem and then provide the service. Sending their agents to harass the customer off the grid is just stupid. Especially in light of this new campaign to get more premium customers. With this story ballooning out of control – I cannot see anyone running to buy into Linden Lab’s broken mainland product.
Anonymous
Nov 30th, 2008
@ Two Worlds
We call that ‘spergin. lol
Funaria
Nov 30th, 2008
I happen to know Ravenelle since 2005 and she’s a very pleasant, helpful person. Sorry, but it’s hard to be not on her side in this story. This all sounds like a wannabe-drama to me.
Margrett
Nov 30th, 2008
I know ravenelle since 2005. She has been using walls to harass anyone that gets too close to the infohub for years. She has been abuse reported dozens of times and has caused quite a few dramas because of it. I recall the jewelry guy that was where NCI is and a few others she harassed until they left the area. It is ashame that Linden Lab allow a person that is not even an employee the power to ruin other’s Second Life experience.
Reality
Dec 1st, 2008
Margrett Dearie?
It is a shame that someone like Lias has been allowed to exploit the new users who land in Bear for her own personal gain for so long without anyone trying to put a stop to it.
A “Club School” being run by someone who owns clubs in ANY Sim – set across from an Infohub? Yes – wheel those new users in, ‘teach’ them how to be a good employee and then turn around and ‘employ’ them at your own clubs for a fraction of what someone else might pay them elsewhere or if they learned an actual skill in Second Life.
I applaud this person for putting up this PHANTOM wall and hope Lias goes out of business so this blight can be removed from Second Life once and for all.
Oh! Just so you know – Linden Lab owns the server system, they own the Infohub – They cannot be accused of “Unfair use of Sim Resources”. Those in the affected Region really do not have any room to complain about the number of Avatars present – 37 out of 50 and you cannot move? Bullshit – get a better fucking computer.
Margrett
Dec 1st, 2008
From what I have seen – the CLUB SCHOOL cost a minimum of $500L per class. nothing a noob can afford. All of Lias’ staff earn $100L as hosts and $150L as Djs. Most clubs just have people work for tips. The school does not survive from training noobs and the VooDoo Lounge or one of her venues has been in operation in Bear sim way before Torley asked her did she want a infohub there for NEW PLAYERS TO REZ AND EXPLORE. She was even there before the Lindens built a road in Bear. The CLUB SCHOOL never used the warm bodies loitering in a parking lot. I see her advertisements in the classifieds, in SLX and in Services of the forums. And if she wanted to monopolize on the crowd in the parking lot why would she complain for a year until Ravenelle retaliated? She should be happy about the mass gathering. It would mean more innocent victims. Your argument is not very convincing. And the sim limit in bear is now 50. And that was maxed out yesterday. Linden Lab can end the nastiness of this situation by moving the hut and loiterers to a place where they could enjoy their chats without inconveniencing someone paying hundreeds of dollars a year for their product.
Junelle
Dec 2nd, 2008
Lias is a control freak who is just having her own negative energy returned to her. I can guarantee that she brought this upon herself with her shitty and abusive behaviour.
I used to work for her, until I realised what a controlling, egotistical, pinchpenny, manipulative hypocrite she is.
She is just another SL leech, who takes herself and SL way too seriously.
Margrett
Dec 2nd, 2008
Again, This is not about personalities, karma or just-rewards. it is about a service company allowing other customers to harass another. And it’s over a parking lot. Creating a situation that should have been resolved a year ago.
I am so sorry you were so emotional damaged by your employment in her club (lol). But you just described every well-known club owner anywhere.
Jahar Aabye
Dec 2nd, 2008
Whatever happened to the saying “Good fences make good neighbors?”
I’ll have to go check this wall out later, but from what’s been described, I’m really not seeing where the issue is. Someone put up a phantom wall at the Bear infohub. The wall is described as being transparent on the outside, so others can see in, their view is thus not blocked by the wall. The wall is being described as having trees on it on the infohub side. Perhaps this is to block an unwanted view? Or maybe they just really wanted a tree background. Dunno, but since the view of the people in the adjacent plot doesn’t seem to be affected, if it really is transparent, and since the wall is phantom and thus not impairing anyone’s ability to move through it, then I don’t really see why it’s creating an issue. The only serious problem that I see is that it’s a megaprim (ughhh) and those can cause some rendering issues, but since it’s phantom it shouldn’t cause any of the physics issues that megaprims bring. So yeah, I can see how people might complain that it adds to the client-side rendering lag.
But aside from that, where’s the issue? Someone in the Bear infohub put up a wall that prevents people in the infohub from seeing an adjacent parcel, without obstructing the view of the people in that parcel?
Quel horreur
2 cents
Dec 2nd, 2008
“it is about a service company allowing other customers to harass another.”
who said these guys were providing any kind of service?
they have no clue what ‘service’ begins to behave like!
oh wait – hold up – yea they do provide a service, a service that gives people a new way to harrass one another over beyond what they already do in RL on the streets, over their backyard fences and in the shopping malls.
well I’ll be damned, that’s one heck of a service right there!
for how much you say? 9.99 a month?
hot Damn! Sign me up!
HuH?
whatcha mean?
no f’n way!
no way ur pullin my leg!
Are you serious?
I can get in on this action for FREE?
Zip – Zero – Zilch?
No Interest? No monthly payments?
SIGN
ME
THE
FUCK
UP!
LMAO
Jahar Aabye
Dec 2nd, 2008
Ok, so I checked out the place…did anyone from the Herald actually, y’know, go and look at the wall before publishing this?
The wall is indeed phantom and is transparent from the outside. It appears to be firmly inside the property line. It doesn’t obstruct the view of anyone outside of it.
The only purpose that the wall appears to serve is to give the residents inside the infohub a nice forest view instead of looking directly at a wall covered in advertisements across the street.
(however, the wall could probably have been made without megaprims, since they’re only 20×20, they could have just as easily used 10×10)
Margrett
Dec 2nd, 2008
Linden Lab told the tier payers of the Bear sim that the infohub would be there for new players to explore their sim. If Linden Lab wanted a private parcel for the new players then they could push a button and rez a island. I do nto see any of the builds across from the hub looking exceptionally great
The bikini store and the shop next to it are just stone bunkers with signs on them also. Linden Lab has no right to rez a spitewall between their property and the tier payers in the sim. What sort of message does that send to people? “You can build but if we don’t like it we will get you”. But those builds were there for 6 months before the Linden Infohub spitewall was erected. Lias won’t go so LL is allowing their agent to up the ante on her. And a few innocent Bear tier payers get harassed also. It is stupid of Ll to allow this to go on any longer. make it a non issue and move the Hub. it is useless.
IntLibber Brautigan
Dec 2nd, 2008
Ok as far as I can see, the fact that the wall is transparent from the OUTSIDE, but not the INSIDE indicates to me that Ravenelle/Torley want to:
a) prevent noobs from seeing adjacent businesses, i.e. causing them damage
b) making them transparent on the outside means those adjacent businesses and their customers are still lagged to hell by having to rezz all the noobs hanging out in the infohub. If the outside was opaque, their lag would be reduced,
So the wall is clearly not there to help them at all, it is intended to hinder neighbors commercial activities. Sad but not surprising, LL’s predatory behavior toward their best PAYING customers is now legendary, which is why they have an unsatisfactory rating from the Better Business Bureau.
Junelle
Dec 2nd, 2008
“I am so sorry you were so emotional damaged by your employment in her club.”
And I am so sorry you feel so defensive about it that you have decided to project your hysterical and hyperbolic thoughts onto me. I’m not damaged, I moved on to other gainful, rewarding adventures when I realised what a selfish twit she was. That doesn’t mean I took an oath to not point out her behaviour.
This is just another one of her paranoid tempests in a teapot.
And it isn’t every club owner. I have hosted for places that treated us with respect, instead of treating us as if they owned our avatars and overreached into our personal lives.
Maybe if she treated SL as a community rather than a tool to extract money and “power” from others, she wouldn’t always be surrounded by drama. This situation doesn’t exist in a vacuum, you know. She has a history of this sort of thing, and never misses an opportunity to take a shot at her perceived enemies while trying to martyr herself.
Anyway, I’ve said my piece, you can now return to patrolling this comment section, defending your idol.
Insight Homewood
Dec 3rd, 2008
this IS SL, right? An offer to move was declined. What for? As another poster pointed out, it’s a simple task to take your stuff and put it down someplace else. It’s also very easy to leave a sign with the new SLURL on it. If she advertises it is a simple matter to edit the add with the new SLURL. Sounds to me like this article is totally one-sided and biased.This owner is totally sucked into SL as if it was REAL estate. It’s virtual server space. Get virtual already, stop acting real.
Betty Boop
Dec 3rd, 2008
Why should a premium account holder be forced to pick up thousands of prims, all custom builds, and move to who-knows-where after paying the service provider since 2005 to be on the Bear server? She was there the week that sim rezzed. At least a month before a road or telhub. Torley asked hr in 2006 if she wanted a infohub there and she agreed. He said it was for new players to rez and explore (as it was used for until 2007). This customer should not be inconvenienced because of the wife of a employee of the service provider. That’s just crazy.
If anyone is acting crazy over a small parcel its Ravenelle – and she has never had to pay a dime in Bear sim. Unlike Lias who pays hundreds a year. The other crazies are the bunch hanging out in the infohub. Get a life, get a grip – go pick your ass somewhere else. Problem solved.
I found the first documented complaint about overcrowding of Lias Leandros aka bladyblue Bommerang – all the way back in March of 2007
http://forums.secondlife.com/showthread.php?t=160923
And Torley’s communication with her regarding the infohub build
March, 2006
http://forums.secondlife.com/showthread.php?t=93484
So be very aware if you decide to agree to do anything with Linden Lab. You will probably be GOM’d in the same manner.