Strokerz Toyz/Eros LLC Takes Linden Lab to Court in Class Action Lawsuit!!!
by Alphaville Herald on 15/09/09 at 8:43 pm
Lawsuit seeks injunction against Linden Research to prevent intellectual property rights infringement in Second Life
by Pixeleen Mistral, National Affairs desk
Shannon Grei and Kevin Aldermann's Eros LLC have filed a complaint in US District Court in Northern California against Linden Reseach alleging "Linden Lab, with knowing and conscious intent to do so, profits in multiple ways and at multiple stages from the illegal conduct" and asks for an injunction to halt the activity. Eros LLC markets a line of sex animations for the virtual world of Second Life, and has built a successful business – but the accumulated frustrations with the weak enforcement of intellectual property rights on the part of Linden Lab seem to have reached the breaking point.
When the Herald contacted Stroker Serpentine for comment, Mr. Serpentine (Kevin Aldermann in real life) said, "This is not about financialgain. Seldom do class actions result in substantial class settlements.This is about a pattern of ambivelence over six years. We wantfundamental change in the regard to the very content and creators thatmade SL what it is today."
The complaint begins:
The illegal conduct alleged includes
Grei by reproducing and displaying her copyrighted works within Second Life, and by materially contributing to and supervising the infringing conduct of others within Second Life."
We will have much more on this breaking story once we finished reading the complaint – if Stroker is as successful with this legal action as he has been with legal actions in the past, the Lindens may have their hands full.
IntLibber Brautigan
Sep 15th, 2009
You realize of course that under Barnes v Yahoo in the 9th circuit (http://web20.nixonpeabody.com/np20/np20blog/Lists/Posts/Post.aspx?List=5374facc-7ab2-482c-8bea-810457ec74db&ID=333) (assuming they filed in California or similar western points), that the LL Terms of Service obligates LL to enforcing it irrespective of court judgements. For LL to fail to actively enforce its own TOS constitutes a promissory estoppel issue, and leaves the lab wide open to some serious judgements.
brinda allen
Sep 15th, 2009
WOW! This will be interesting to say the least!
Judge Joker
Sep 15th, 2009
Strokers got balls for being able to stand in front of a real world judge and stating he makes virtual world sexual animations and toys.
I wonder who will be able to keep a straight face in that court room.
While Linden Labs appose you in there fine suits as the masters of getting you to do there “dirty” work by making you make all there content for there virtual world, oh and some how being kind enough to let you cash out profit.
A successful business is not located on the Internet were content can be copied, cut, ripped, and distributed were the lawless rains supreme your law suit is doomed to fail.
You own your content, you have the DMCA and make money what more do you want? more sales for throwing out a Class Action Lawsuit.
Did your sales drop so much when Linden Labs made Adult Sims and moved over the xstreet forum? that you need to fabricate some issue or trouble to get noticed!
Doubledown Tandino
Sep 15th, 2009
He’s got big balls!
Don’t bite the hand that feeds ya.
All Seeing Eye
Sep 16th, 2009
Let the retaliations begin. LL must be pouring over IM logs right this minute to see who knew about this and/or was involved. Expect bannings and content destruction to ensue. As well as accidental loss of bytes from the asset system with no backups because all of the backups got destroyed in a tragic accident. And wtf is this thing someone asked about in answers… some sort of resident content tool or something that supposedly appeared as a support type? wtf is that about suddenly appearing a few days ago with nothing anywhere supporting the reason for it’s existence. could that be related?
Strokerisanidiot
Sep 16th, 2009
Way to bite the hand that feeds you.
Miro Collas
Sep 16th, 2009
I think he’s just annoyed that his sales have plummeted, and thinks it is all due to people stealing his stuff. He overlooks that there are now MANY superior products, all original, all cheaper. His brand used to be the only game in town, aside from stolen stuff. But not anymore.
A lot of “old” SL are finding themselves in this situation: they used to rule, now they don’t, and they haven’t tried to keep up, to innovate, and they do not understand why their sales have gone into the toilet.
All IMHO, of course.
Rick
Sep 16th, 2009
Good for Eros and Stroker. LL has played much to freely with the rules of the world they opened up. We see it in their decisions about Adult content, Open Sims, and intelectual property concerns. It’s about time someone held them accountable
John Marks
Sep 16th, 2009
Look at the bigger picture here people. There are copybots all over the grid. Creators work hard on their work in sl, hours of work, their vision and creatity goes in to that, and others just copy the thing and set it to sale within minutes. Stroker is doing us all a favour by trying to force LL to protect those that are making SL worth while. Cheers Stroker!
IntLibber Brautigan
Sep 16th, 2009
@Judge Joker:
“A successful business is not located on the Internet were content can be copied, cut, ripped, and distributed were the lawless rains supreme your law suit is doomed to fail.”
Sorry you fail at Teh Intertubez 101. Some of the most valuable companies on the planet “is located on the internet”: iTunes, Google, etc, where all they offer is digital content.
@Miro:
“He overlooks that there are now MANY superior products, all original, all cheaper”
I dont know of ANY other bed maker producing their own custom animations using motion capture suits. Please let me know if I’m missing someone here. Most all other bed makers are selling beds made with scripts stolen from his products. Please detail who is being original and how.
@All Seeing Eye:
“Let the retaliations begin.”
Your legal ignorance is showing. If LL started doing that, Strokerz’ judge would rather quickly deliver a summary judgement in favor of Strokerz. Plaintiff intimidation, esp in an environment where everything is recorded, is extremely stupid.
Johnny alt
Sep 16th, 2009
Applauds Mr Serpentine’s balls of steel.
It does appear to many that Linden Labs are ambivelent and careless with the Intellectual property of their content creators.
Linden Labs really do need to get their act together in regards to Intellectual Property. The DMCA process is antiquated and inadequate for virtual goods and their failure to ban the thieves and remove the stolen content from the Secondlife database is actually an act of unacceptable negligence. It’s very clear that Linden Labs do not show due diligence, the consequence being that they encourage and profit from IP theft and ‘unfair competition’.
It is clearly unfair for content creators to have to compete with stolen versions (exact duplicates) of their own copyrighted products.
It beggars belief that Linden Labs have acted so carelessly for so long. Their grid is now so full of stolen, copybotted content that they are surely on very shaky ground
Just a Boy
Sep 16th, 2009
@ Everyone saying, “Way to bite the hand that feeds you” etc.
No, in actuality LL is biting the hands that feed THEM. I truly believe that content creation is a big reason why this world is thriving, whether people do it as a hobby or a full time job; commercially, or personally; it doesnt matter- It all helps to build this world. Thievery affects everyone. Period. Its absurd people are actually saying he has no right to do this and is “biting the hand that feeds him”. So hes supposed to sit back, hunched in a corner, being abused, and stolen from even though he makes money here? Thats akin to a woman in RL who has a husband who feeds her, shelters her, and clothes her, but everynight he disregards and beats the shit out of her. You shame her for having thoughts of telling Authority because he helps her survive, “But he shelters you! he clothes you! Dont bite the hand that feeds you!.” Give me a break! Law is law. Regardless of what medium or platform. And laws are being broken here by LL, and whether or not LL are the ones enabling us to make money or not, they are NOT above the law. And im glad someone finally has the means to attempt to stand against the blatant disregard LL has for IP rights. Sure, they care about it to an extend, but its on, and has always been on, their back burner.
Wharrblgarble
Sep 16th, 2009
Borrowed from The Cryolife Papers article.
“Today we are in a similar situation in Second Life. You can adjust your business decision calculations based on the threat posed by piracy or you can ignore it, waste energy by blaming Linden Labs for something they cannot control and stubbornly refuse to acknowledge the threat.”
Stroker is already making a sizeable profit through his SL businesses, upwards of $1 Million USD I read here. The sooner that he just accepts that content theft is inevitable to a degree, the better. If he’s making that much money *despite* the alleged content theft then surely he has to realise that he’s on to a good thing? I’m not condoning content theft of course; I’m simply pointing out that he’s making a fantastic profit *in spite of it*.
Madame Maracas
Sep 16th, 2009
I have 2 phrases that come to mind
Ethics are not optional
Manners are not optional
Had LL exercised them both previously, respected the valued work of their residents they’d ASKED to provide content for their world, on spec, this would not have had to happen. What happens to Nomine and Eros/SexGen happens to us all, cheapening our SL experience, making us all complicit in thieves’ acts.
Who are the thieves?
They’re the ones ripping off content & sales from hard working content creators.
That does include Linden Lab, since they take a percentage of transactions in their online market, they take a percentage of Lindens cashed out to USD, and because they get rent/tier from those running black market shops. Every time something ripped off gets sold, and that money moves around, the crime ripples through the grid.
This is not a simple matter.
This effects us all.
This should never have had to get to this point.
Linden Lab chose to stick their head in the sand and hope no one got their stuff together enough to call them to the mat.
It is an ugly business, and I am certain that had the other “tools” available to us all had worked, Stroker and Munchflower wouldn’t have taken these steps. Who would want to?
That’s my 2L.
David Crespo
Sep 16th, 2009
Love it when people applaud SL residents for taking the Lab to task over their short comings. The hypocrisy is even more ironic, when the same people ‘bitch’ about RL brands stopping SL designers from ripping off their IP. What is the difference?!
The real issue here? These two so called designers, are out of date. Have you seen how their products have dated and been taken over by new and more original designs? If this isn’t a case of sour grapes, I don’t know what is.
I DO KNOW THE REAL STORY HERE:
Stroker got a shit load of publicity when he did this last time, he took a class action against an individual. It boosted his sales and notoriety. This is a marketing tactic, he got face time on TV and across a zillion blogs. Stop feeding his sales funnel, by ignoring this obvious publicity stunt.
Metacam Oh
Sep 16th, 2009
Its funny how people here actually think LL feeds them. Feeds them what, a huge ass ponzi scheme and a fake dream? Give me a break. Hats off to Stroker for doing something, and besides this most likely in response to when a Linden employee intentionally from the inside “broke” the sex gen beds all over the grid.
Eriko
Sep 16th, 2009
So did someone steal his scripts? I thought his former business partner was selling his stuff, saying it was co-created or something like that. I don’t believe you can steal scripts, at least not yet. And scripts are pretty much this guys business. The prim part of his creations are not all that unique. At this point, the animations and scripts are pretty dated also. I’ve seen much better ones out there.
PixPol
Sep 16th, 2009
Pixels and Policy just put up some analysis on the issue – great piece by the way!
http://www.PixelsandPolicy.com
David Crespo
Sep 16th, 2009
Stroker is being fed very well here, he reports to have revenues of $1,000,000USD. As for breaking his beds? Total hogwash, pure speculation and not proven. LL change LSL, which means products have to be updated. This is an environment of change, with the kind of revenue Stroker has in place, he should have a support and upgrade team.
The reality here, if Stroker doesn’t like it. He should move on to another platform, it would seem he’s had nothing but hardship and is a broken man. Must be very hard to wake up each day knowing that you’re going to be making around $2,739?
The ponzi scheme here is the early adopter pyramid, Stroker was one of the first in, therefore he think’s LL owe him more on the downstream. The reality is, SL has grown. Which means new down streams of sellers, and new ways to sell products.
The other change? People don’t ask for recommendation of sellers/designers anymore. They simply hit Xstreet and search on product description, decisions are made on price and whimsy. New users are actively encouraged to do this, it breaks with the tradition of ‘shop browsing’ in SL. Therefore, the ‘names’ in the SL lexicon are finding it harder and harder. The big mistake in XStreet is ignoring the ‘designers story’ it’s just a catalogue of products and names.
If Stroker was serious, he would put his energies into getting more creative on the marketing front. That would be more productive. Or maybe channel that experience into a diversification of product line.
I cannot also help thinking this is also in reaction to Zindra? I wonder if he will file a ‘forced eviction by landlord’ due to the relocation? The reality is, the sex trade in SL is going to nose dive. Mainly due to the restrictive nature of supply and demand. M Linden is cleaning up the house, he wants SL to be a PG13 friendly Theme Park. All ready and Californian-gleaming for a sale or IPO.
I also hope that Munchflower knows what she is getting into here, it all seems very hanger-on in terms of her involvement.
Miro Collas
Sep 16th, 2009
@IntLibber Brautigan: Henmations (sp?)
Just because you haven’t heard of something doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.
Joxter Hax
Sep 16th, 2009
@John Marks
Luna Animations makes and scripts every product by hand. All content is original and of very high quality. Stop by Luna Prime sometime and be educated.
Joxter Hax
Sep 16th, 2009
oops, sorry that last comment should be directed to IntLibber Brautigan.
Jumpman Lane
Sep 16th, 2009
hey davy crespo i beg to differ. sex will always sell. UNLESS linden lab decides to do completely away with sex in SL. Eros has their own mini continent. they werent required to move to that lag-dump Zindra. The VIEWER change perhaps harmed their Vegas sim, (poor noobs coulndt find muchless access it caws noobs dont ageverify day one) but day ol noobswere hardly eros’ sex bed market.
things arent BAD or even tuff in the sex anims market, infact business is a booming. there are just so many more (better?) sex beds etc on the market that COMPETITION is the key word.
this strikes me all as a publicity stunt, because Linden Lab says allthe right things about ip right, does all that is legally required, so that no one is going to say that LL is personally violating Eros trademarks or abetting anyone who is. they spell out the dmca policy , there are channels to handle such thing. The Lab’s hands are clean.
IF this is just for publicity, playin chicken withthe lab HAS its rewards, but as a bunch and as a rule LINDENS though pesky by nature, are downright vindictive when provoked.
So Good Luck Stroker. Trailblazer all the way!
Amira Footman
Sep 16th, 2009
Ok, please correct me if I have this wrong, but am I correct in thinking that the base of the action against LL is for basically ‘enabling’ content theives? Isn’t that a bit like getting hit by a drunk person in a bar and then taking the owners of the bar to court for selling alcohol? We are ALL adults in Second Life, we ALL have personal responsibility for our actions, the only people to blame for content theft…. are the content theives! What Stroker and Ms Grei need to try and consider that this, if it gets anywhere near a courtroom, isn’t going to just be about IP theft. It will have HUGE ramifications for the level of involvement LL has generally in what we do in SL. I fear it will erase any personal freedom we have in SL at all, for LL’s fear of being sued. The entire way SL works will change, in essence, it will become There. Which would mean, um, sorry but no sex beds, no sex furniture, no nothing that could cause even the most sensitive person offence. I support any content creator’s right to protect their work but I do not support this lawsuit. As someone who enjoys having responsible personal freedom in SL, for example I have a SL family that includes child avatars, the consequences of the actions by these two individuals scares me.
Jimbo
Sep 17th, 2009
LOL
This is great. Not only is Stroker going to end up spending a fortune on this lawsuit but if he wins, he’ll effectively kill SL. Because his plan of attack is to strip away LL’s use of the DMCA Safe Harbor provision as a defense. Once that’s gone, sure, he’ll win. But there goes the virtual porn and virtual prostitution that probably form the foundation for the vast majority of SL’s economy. And if LL is then responsible for everything that it’s customers do, LL will shut everything down to avoid prosecution by any zealous local or federal prosecutor. Talk about the old adage, “be careful for what you ask for; you might get it”. Good luck Stroker!
Peanut
Sep 17th, 2009
Stroker and LL deserve each other.
They both play out of the same business “ethics” hand book.
Like when Stroker once tried to bully other animation makers after decided he owned the idea of placing scripted anims inside prims… rofl
This latest publicity stunt is just more self-righteous hubris, born of the fear of losing what he once had because SL is changing. Yawn.
The dream can’t last forever. Reality is catching up with your little snowglobe world whose tit you’ve been sucking for longer than most people could hope for.
Be thankful >> next phase.
Lalina
Sep 17th, 2009
I agree, this is greed when I saw this lawsuit NO ONE WANTS sexgen or munch items, they are the past there are much better places to shop whether cheaper or more expensive, what you get for your dime is much more meaty than what you get from them. I agree this is about him not making his money. He even mentioned before that his family is suffering because he was only making 400k usd. ONLY??? talk about greed in our current nation financial situation
Lalina
Sep 17th, 2009
I also confirm I remember the same story he gave away full perms of his items to someone else so now he cries about it. There is no mention of that in his lawsuit either. I hope linden labs finds those chat logs to use to show. And Munch filing about how copyright infringement when in 2006 photo sourced items graced her walls for shame!
janeforyou Barbara
Sep 17th, 2009
sex sells in PG sims….i took a look in search..i set it on PG only..typed in “Lesbian” 8 sims poped up full of “Adult” search words..all are sexclubs or nude beaches even shops… then i turned on “Mature” in search 19 sims with “adult” search words poped up.. after sept 15 all this are suppose to be set ” adult”
Zindra the “Adult” land and lots of other that do follow the rules set there land to “adult”. i know there are 30.000 Sims in SL.. but i had a email from the lab telling me what to do to do all leagal and i did it.. it pisses me off that The Lab dont chekk all this that abuse the rules and brakes the rules get away with it!!
Stroker and me and lots of others that advertise for sex items we sell are trying to do the right stuff.My business are not big, but i do like to have total ownersip on it.
Coke Supply
Sep 17th, 2009
Stroker’s sim seems to be closed at the moment – his profile says he’s remodelling the sim – access is currently closed
Noor Loam
Sep 18th, 2009
Stroker who, Munchflower who?! What a coincidence, to start some class whatever act suit right at the adult change in SL. This stroker dude is so 2004 in his content creation, same is for munchie. No one buys their crap anymore. I wouldn’t want to have neither one of their items for free. Why would anyone copy badly made skins, or spend 5K on some badly made prim bed nowadays?!
There are amazing content creators out there like Wolfe’s Mocap beds, who has been in world for a long time as well. But he goes and grows with the everchanging times in SL. Our need and desire for new creations is way more pushy then it was in 2006, hence content creators are bombarding us weekly with new items, because we live a very fast life in SL.
Stroker is not doing this for ” Others “, he is a greedy bastard, who is a has been and can not fathom the fact, no one wants his shit anymore. He pretty much, ( if he wins, which I highly doubt! ), will mess up a lot and not for the better. However LL may implement some new rules/ TOS, which will affect anyone in the Adult Business, win or loss of the suit.
As some said, don’t bite the hand that feeds you, so true – some old man who’s shining days of SL are a blast of the past. I wonder how much of his $1 mill, he reported to the department of revenue. I am sure there are loopholes and I hope the court will dig so dam deep into his dam shit and LL get him of the grid!
jamie Cheeky
Sep 20th, 2009
“I dont know of ANY other bed maker producing their own custom animations using motion capture suits. Please let me know if I’m missing someone here. Most all other bed makers are selling beds made with scripts stolen from his products. Please detail who is being original and how.”
@John Marks – how rude!!, I guess those months I spent making my animations by hand were my imagination then! Every single one of my animations in our OPEN SOURCE MLP scripted beds have been made by ME in poser and I find it narrow minded that you think that no one but stroker can make a decent anim!
Jumpman Lane
Sep 20th, 2009
@Noor Loam that is my take onthe situation exactly. people HAVE stolen the beds and offered em at a deep discount but no one wants those crappy eros beds at all. this lawsuit is a last gasp effort to revive a dying brand. it will only serve to make secondlife worse for the average player if LL institutes even ONE new crappy rule, or is finacially destabilized by this frivilous suit. Since his minions/employees spent all spring and summer stealing redgrave skins and passingthem out allover the grid, he is mostcertainly NOT a champion of content creator’s rights. (Cheergirl Allen and Chelsea Malibu ACT LIKE THEY DIDNT LMAO!)
@JAMIE CHEEKS from what i hear The old Man never scripted shit, hasnt made the first anim used in anything in the past, basically shitted corsi moushold outta profits, and aint usint that fat suit, i mean anim suit for anything.
We support the lab. Djquad Radio of Roadkill tees has made a group called Friends of The lab. I for oe am joining up
we gonna pretend people by eros Products and boycott that bullshit, raise money for the lindens legal defence and w/e else wecan dream up to stir up crap onna the grid. because we LOVE sl, and might be fun to kneecap that oldie turd for kix, for frees, for lulz, for god, for the lab, and for slut magazine
jamie cheeky
Sep 21st, 2009
@ Jumpman Lane – yup I heard the same thing, If this is true and he didnt script a single thing then how can he continue with this lawsuit? how can you cliam rights for something you didnt create!
*ponders that one*
JayJay
Oct 10th, 2009
I’ve gotta say, I’ve had dealings with Stroker, and to be honest, he comes across as quite egotistical and unfriendly. He is ruthless in driving competition away, and using dirty tactics. He thrives off threatening legal action against anyone he feels threatened by. He wants his name plastered all over everything related to Second Life. His ridiculous claim for a lawsuit is just another way for him to steal a bit of limelight in hopes to boost dwindling sales. I’m glad I am not the only one this is obvious to.
And he is out of his mind if he thinks any good can come from this.
Jumpman Lane
Oct 10th, 2009
@Jaimie Cheeky SexGen(tm) sex beds to this day are made with scripts by Briggi Bard and animations by Corsi Mousehold. These were his former partners. Bard resides in Europe. in short, Briggi Made the first beds, coined the name sex gen, built half of the Amsterdam sim. Corsi added anims in later iterations of sexgen beds. Stroker marked it all. all the beds had a split cscript in them. Stroker trademarked the name sexgen in the us, removed the split script, kept the monies, spold amsterdamn for 10k usd, kept the money, threatend corsi and briggi with a lawsuit if they continued calling their beds sexgen, (they call their version neolove now) and stroker conitues to sell briggi scripts and corsi anims in his crap
@Jay Jay the above i reckon is a response to you
It would seem that Stroker Serpentine is the biggest content thief in the history of second life and the corporate culture of eros is one sneak-thievery.
FWord Utorid
Oct 18th, 2009
http://tinyurl.com/yflzef4 contains what I believe to be the original, bsd licensed ‘sex bed scripts’. Stroker needs to suck on his products, and learn to swallow… his pride.
Wayfinder
Mar 9th, 2010
/me applauds in approval at this lawsuit. Frankly, I’m amazed that LL managed to dodge such a bullet with the Open Space Sim bait-and-switch con game. I personally think a few more class action lawsuits might serve the community well– if it would convince that narcissistic company that they ARE accountable to their customers.
John
Mar 9th, 2010
So what is the solution to the content theft? Can Linden labs check every account for stolen items? The only thing I can see that Linden Labs did to allow people to copy items is when Linden Labs allowed
their viewers to become open sourced and opened the door for all of the viewers that allow someone to steal anothers creation.
Does this mean the end of third party viewers now? Since that is the only way to put a quick halt to the ease in which people are ripping items. Some how I see strokerz time in second life coming to an end. It may not be today, you you can bet after the lawsuit him and his other parade of perverts will be marched off the grid.
ScooterB!!!
Mar 9th, 2010
Why sue LL when it is the makers of the other after-market viewers that
caused this problem? Sue the developers of Neil life ,cyro life ,thuglife,
and go back to a single closed source viewer and the problem is
solved.
Wayfinder
Mar 9th, 2010
John, while I won’t argue in regard to Stroker’s occupation… at the same time Linden Lab, in setting up the environment accepted some responsibility for following copyright laws and protecting the content there– as is the case with every other business in the United States.
Their first failure was in putting a total stop to Copybot the moment it was discovered. Now, the mob-mentality nay-sayers claim there is no way to stop Copybot. That is total nonsense. Whatever one coder can make… another coder can break. The bottom line is that Linden Lab was too lazy and too apathetic to put proper safeguards on their system in the first place.
I agree with you that their releasing their viewer code open source was pure stupidity on their part. I knew it they day they announced it, but I didn’t say a word. Why? Because I knew it would open up projects such as Open Sim and frankly, I wanted to see LL have some serious competition.
What you fail to recognize John, is that this isn’t a matter of your morality vs Strokers (and for the record, I don’t disagree with yours. I agree that SL is a cesspool of general perversion, but that’s MY opinion; it’s not my place to enforce my views and beliefs on others). BUT… the general situation that affects Stroker and Munchflower also affects every other merchant and creator on SL, both for-profit and non-profit.
The general “digital rights is bad” mentality is a chaos-driven concept that refuses to recognize the basic rights of creators to protect their property. Just as we have a right to lock our cars and homes… so artists have a right to protect their own items to a sensible degree. Linden Lab’s total refusal and failure to protect creative rights on their system frankly deserved a much more punitive lawsuit than what Stroker and Munch filed. My only regret is that these two let LL get off as lightly as they did… and that I didn’t hear about the class-action suit (IMO, couldn’t have been much of a suit if SL members didn’t receive opportunity to take part in the suit).
I assure you, if I’d had opportunity to enter the suit along side them… I’d have been right there in Linden Lab’s face. They had it coming.
Jumpman Lane
Mar 9th, 2010
the lawsuit against veoh set the precedent.
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/09/judge-safe-harbor-applies-to-veoh-umg-lawsuit-eviscerated.ars
stroker is a turd who started this case to return to relevance and “shape” internet law. all he did was make those pesky lindens interfere in our sl’s again in their usual ham handed way! i say think up a new way to fuck over stroker today!
Digima
Mar 9th, 2010
Wonderful! (not) so this story makes the news and all the rest of us in SL will all look like purveyors or porn.
I can tell you why stroker and the other twits are suing LL, the software developers of the other viewers have no money and these idiots saw how LL was really fast to settle with Taser when the crack den was selling virtual knock-offs of their product.
I sincerely hope that LL stands their ground on this law suit and wins. Then throw the trouble makers out of SL for making the rest of us look bad.
pornography belongs in one place and one place only…. The recycle bin.
Jumpman Lane
Mar 10th, 2010
Fuck you Digima! You aint no god damn body! WE make porn in Second Life and Philip Linden his goddamned self told the head of the MacArthur Foundation that SL is a free space like the internet as a whole and that HE had no intetion of removing pornography from it. We dont oppose Stroker Serpentine because he makes sex crap. We oppose Stroker because he is a flake, a hypocrite, a liar, a thief etc etc and has been PROVEN to be so IN THIS PUBLICATION.
Furthur, we support LL because WEEKS before the story broke Alfa Winger of SLCAMZ told me that Stroker was planning this basicaly as a publicity stunt.
This all came about BEFORE there was any issue with VIEWERS being used as a means of stealing IP in sl. The people who actually stole SexGen(R) sex crap we’rent using viewers to do it.
LL will respond to ip theft, they will win their suit, Sroker will summarily be deactivated as an account. Hell Jumpman Lane might be deactivated to. But Jumpman Lane has been deactivated before.
Jumpy did it all on his own
Turned a chair to a throne
He’s a king and that’s why
He stunts HARD!
He put the whole grid on
To some things they never woulda known
If he didnt STUNT HARD!
And every night is a premier
If he ever disappear
Best believe he’s comin back!
STUNT HARD!
[10:39] Jumpman Lane: If I don’t do nothin’ I’m gonna STUNT. MY. A$$. OFF!
Wayfinder
Mar 10th, 2010
@ScooterB: Two reasons you sue Linden Lab:
1) That’s where the $$$ is. Hard to sue people who are likely broke societal rejects.
2) A little thing called “criminal negligence”… namely, allowing known harm to continue to come to customers due to failure / refusal to prevent such harm. (Yes, this is actually illegal. It falls under the legal are of “accessory to criminal acts”).
So those are two reasons. While I agree with you that those who are making such software should also be sued (and quite likely arrested)… rather than wasting time suing each and every individual twit that engages in such activities… go to the source and sue the agency that refused to stop them. This was an intentional decision on Linden Lab’s part. They knew Copybot was being widely used to steal copyrighted materials. That makes them (according to law) potential party to the criminal act– and the situation actionable.
Jumpman Lane
Mar 10th, 2010
turdfinder, i mean wayfinder
enough of ur fantsy rant and time for a lil american jurisprudence
the lawsuit against veoh set the precedent.
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/09/judge-safe-harbor-applies-to-veoh-umg-lawsuit-eviscerated.ars
u sap
Wayfinder
Mar 10th, 2010
Jumpman, spare us the adolescent in yer face attitude. It’s old, trite and not all that impressive. You dude, aren’t as special as you think you are. ; )
Oh wow, it’s not really that hard to cop an attitude and spout drivel. I just did it, like that! Snap! doi
Wayfinder
Mar 10th, 2010
For the record (and for those who think they automatically understand corporate law from reading one news blog)… imagining the Veoh / UMG lawsuit to be universally applicable to all cases of online copyright infringement and hosting issues would be fairly naive. It sets a precedent in one specific area… but case law applies only to identical circumstances. There are very seldom identical circumstances in such endeavors.
I think it would be a considerable stretch of imagination to consider that Veoh / UMB even remotely applies to the situation of Linden Lab and Second Life. I’m not going to go into those differences because at this point it’s fairly obvious there are a bunch of strabismic-mentality trolls here who are just shooting their mouths off to make themselves look large… but the reality of this whole thing falls in the area of “intentional negligence”… one of the scariest aspects of corporate law.
So rather than quoting one single aspect of law and mistakenly thinking that applies to the whole of the computer realm, it might benefit readers to understand that when one crosses the line of intentional decision to NOT do something that quite obviously is harmful to one ore more parties… Safe Harbor at that point becomes a moot point and the area of corporate negligence comes into primary focus. Bottom line (and put very simply): knowledge and intent are 90% of the law. If a corporation were to try to rely on “safe harbor” concepts to excuse willful and intentional non-action encroaching into the areas of severe negligence… well, let’s just say they would deserve what they would get.
Stroker Serpentine
Mar 10th, 2010
On the matter of “precedence” :
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-10-10-internet-defamation-case_x.htm
Corsi Mousehold
Mar 10th, 2010
Stroker Said:
On the matter of “precedence” :
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-10-10-internet-defamation-case_x.htm
But you missed something in there. Here is a quote from the article:
“Bock, who had to leave her home for several months because of Hurricane Katrina, couldn’t afford an attorney and didn’t show up for the trial.”
If you win a court case that is not actually defended, it is a default win. No precedent set at all. Even if the judge agrees with what the defendant would say, legally he cannot side in favor of someone that is not there.
So on the matter of precedence, you don’t have any that you have shown so far.