The Alphaville Herald

53 Responses to “Stolen Goods Free-For-All At Burning Life”

1. 

   LordGregGreg
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   I known Damen Hax for a while. When I found out he uses neillife client. I was shocked me self and told him to use emerald but he didn’t listen to me.
2. 

   Stroker
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   As I have stated in other posts. If this had been a few items I would have likely just contacted the creators and AR’d it and left it at that. When the original box was unpacked there were dozens of more boxes full of more content. I tried my best to light a fire under LL to act upon it quickly. I doubt VERY seriously that LL would have taken the time to unpack all the contents. They would have blacklisted the original box and called it a day. This would have left all the items that were opened to inventory free to saturate the grid and it would have been a perpetually blind DMCA game for everyone involved. I noted the creators and the suspects. I call them suspects because their prims, notecards and containers were they only thing that could be AR’d. If LL does any kind of investigation they will surely see the transaction trail. The pictures speak for themselves. It’s just as important to let people like Damen know that their names are associated with these items. It will never disappear from the grid entirely. Right, wrong or indifferent these boxes will be the source of thousands of AR’s to come. At least this way the creators can decide to discount or give away their content and the suspects if vindicated can be prepared for the impending AR’s as the content traverses the grid. Permissions are being overwritten inside boxes and inventories. This isnt copybot or rollbacks or simple box to box exploits.
3. 

   Wordfromthe Wise
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   Hmm, i can only say that i know Damen Hax now since 2 years. I am one (happy) customer and User of his great HUD. He is always a friendly and a genuine guy. He is into Opensource and gives away all his opensource things inside his HUD completly INTACT with the original script creators name. I once gave him 2 particles as a present and he added it and gave me credit in the scripts and in his HUD and also in the notecard supplied with the HUD. I can not belive he switched to the dark side. Just my 5 Lindens$
4. 

   all just junk?
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   but the question is, IS there anything good in that box or is it all just more junk crapping up the asset servers? I mean, are there any MUST HAVES in that box? I dont think ive heard of any of it, except maybe the Quantum Products stuff
5. 

   BamBam
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   SL imploding… News at 11!
6. 

   Tenshi Vielle
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   The contents of the box is not junk. It’s very valuable Second Life content. Some brand new pieces from popular creators.
7. 

   Bunny Brickworks
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   Junk? You don’t leave your virtual home much, hu? This list reads like the who is who of pose makers and outfitters. You may not like the hooker chic of Stiletto Moody but they are the most expensive shoes on the grid, Vista’s AOs are a must have for every inventory, Jonny Dusk makes the best gun poses and props in SL, :sey makes gorgeous and quite expensive clothes…

   Calling this kind of content junk just shows you don’t spend many Lindens on quality goods.
8. 

   Anonymous
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   “The contents of the box is not junk. It’s very valuable Second Life content. Some brand new pieces from popular creators.”

   More like utterly useless crap. $0.01usd to upload a texture, $0.00usd to rez a prim, and a measly few hours of spare time to slap it all together. For what? A fake graphical representation of a thing – a bed, shoe, chair that you’re reselling for a 200% markup. And what’s it all used for? Folks to play with! Reality check! Its a game, get over it!

   You idiots are going on with some holy fucking crusade based on greed and just down right stupidity meanwhile that rickety little tree fort you’re all playing in is about to crash to the ground and burn.
9. 

   Kae
   

   Oct 27th, 2009
   

   This is a leftover from an exploit that was fixed months ago, and this person was likely sitting on the content.

   The empty box is the key, and it had to do with re-saving shift-selected contents back to an object’s inventory, so it required the stolen content be “selected” with a full-perms object. In order to make it appear if the pirate did not actually pirate the content, they could simply use someone else’s box as the “base prim,” which would explain why this guy’s name is attached to it.

   With this exploit, it was possible to transfer no-transfer items while not actually -copying- anything. It would save the actual physical item back to contents, so it’s not like it’s a copybotted item that can be identified by creator since the actual creator’s name, the correct timestamps, and the right prim names will all be included.

   LL closed this loophole back in July though, so any content that’s floating around is basically grandfathered in from that time, and if it’s removed from the asset server, there’s no way for it to pop back up again.
10. 

    NOT NEIL
    

    Oct 27th, 2009
    

    Neillife must die.
11. 

    Emperor Norton Hears a Who?
    

    Oct 27th, 2009
    

    “More like utterly useless crap.” @ Anonymous

    Then go make it yourself blowhard since it is so easy instead of leeching off other people’s work. That is if you have the talent to do it.
12. 

    Jumpman Lane
    

    Oct 27th, 2009
    

    “Yet despite frantic reports of ongoing theft by Stroker Serpentine”
    I doubt that since the asset uuid to those stolen Redgrave Skins can prob be traced to a couple of his closest associates. I’m gonna send that uuid to some of my linden pals and see what’s what heheheheheheheh
13. 

    Stroker Serpentine
    

    Oct 27th, 2009
    

    @Kae, I respectfully disagree. If you will look at the full-sized image of this picture you will see that the perms have been reset to Copy/Mod/Transfer.

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/51358983@N00/4049255246/sizes/o/in/set-72157622547893927/

    I am very familiar with the “attach a full perm drag/click link object to no trans” And indeed it was closed. It used the overhead toolbar “Save to Inventory”. This isnt an “exploit”. It is the capability for content thieves to set perms at will. It exists and has been confirmed. It criples functionality of creator set permissions by overriding/disabling/modifying the “slam bit” in the client code. At least this is what I am being told by respected client devs. Once the object is rezzed on the grid it reverts to original creator perms. Many of the creators of these objects confirmed this upon inspection.

    The debate as to whether scripts our animations can be copied is irrelevent.As long as these objects are kept inside another prim, vendor or inventory they will remain copiable. Several of us have painstakenly confirmed this.This is a client issue. Not an inworld bug/exploit issue. Also, it apparently has existed for quite some time. We first became aware of it when full perm items were showing up because thieves were forgetting to redo next owner perms and they were being passed from avatar to avatar with full perms intact (they were reselling, so obviously they didn’t intend for that to happen) This was late last year.At first we thought it was a bug server side and reported it.

    It’s possible that the notecard exploit going forward has been disabled. However, the notecards that were within these boxes were fully capable of transferring the animations listed on them full perm to inventory.

    I truly wish this was a matter of bug behavior. I’m not that optimistic. Something has to be done about the modified clients that are created specifically to override/disable perms. I am personally not an advocate of chilling third party client development. However, at this point only LL can address this issue. It is not a matter of “policing our own content”. I am also not a subscriber to the “just make more” meme. Damned if I am going to spend hours, weeks and days for some asshat to profit from my labor merely because he/she has no regard for ethical behavior.
14. 

    Stroker Serpentine
    

    Oct 27th, 2009
    

    @Jumpman

    “I doubt that since the asset uuid to those stolen Redgrave Skins can prob be traced to a couple of his closest associates. I’m gonna send that uuid to some of my linden pals and see what’s what heheheheheheheh”

    So…you *CAN* grasp at something besides your cock??!!
15. 

    Anonymous
    

    Oct 27th, 2009
    

    “Then go make it yourself blowhard since it is so easy instead of leeching off other people’s work. That is if you have the talent to do it.” – @ Norton

    I am, and I’m sharing it all for free with the sources included. Not on SL, and I won’t bother to say where cause the last thing I need in my life is to deal with a bunch of bat shit crazy self important IP rights whack jobs like you folks knocking on my front door screaming that I pirated a bunch of shit that I clearly took the time to make on my own. So yeah, have a nice life with that one.

    Just think of this. Who’s IP rights are you trampling when you go making and profiting from virtual knockoffs of rl goods? Last time I was over on SL I took the time to report at least 10 different virtual “companies” that were infringing upon the IP rights of real companies to both Linden and the RL companies themselves. Multiple shoe designers including Nike and Converse – yeah good job Akeyo, Lonsdale London who had their complete product line ripped off and resold on SL under their own name, and several game companies who blatantly had their textures and design ideas ripped off and resold in SL.
16. 

    Lili
    

    Oct 27th, 2009
    

    A little bird just told me, this whole incident was cooked up to help with certain people’s lawsuits. You see, it has to appear that there is absolutely nothing content creators can do to fight theft. It has to appear that LL is wholly responsible.

    If this lawsuit goes the way these people want it to, the first thing I’m going in real life is sue my local police department. People have been stealing my ideas for years. And I shouldn’t have to do anything about that. The police should know I don’t want my ideas used and stop these people, without me even pointing them out. They even walk into my store and steal things. Just because I never lock the doors, they feel it’s ok. And everyone knows the police should have cameras everywhere, so we don’t have to worry about these things. And just because my friends and business partners steal, is no excuse to steal from us. Now I even have to wonder if I have enough gas in my hummer to make it to walmart, so I can look fashionable. Someone should be responsible for these things! Just not me.
17. 

    GEOO BLANK
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    http://neillife-lol.blogspot.com/2009/10/thank-you-everyone-i-kind-of-feel-bad.html

    DONT NOT BLAME NEILLIFE FOR DIS BULLSHIT
18. 

    I'm Just Sayin'
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    Lili said – “A little bird just told me, this whole incident was cooked up to help with certain people’s lawsuits.”

    Think about this Lili. You’re currently in a very high profile legal case involving intellectual property in Second Life. Your legal people would probably advise you to avoid getting entangled in any online discussions because you might say something that could prejudice your case and be used against you. And as expected, despite a large amount of discussion, you don’t come out and join the debates. Then suddenly this issue arises and suddenly you’re online and commenting despite still being entangled in this high profile case. That’s fishier than Captain Birdseye’s fucking thong, don’t you think?

    This current issue is (in my opinion) a scam designed to push the agenda of certain individuals needing to create an impression that they can use against LL.
19. 

    Plus 1
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    holy shit what if LL got sued by everyone for being not noticing these bugs. I also talked to a random developer from the emerald team which told me Linden labs knew about the notecard hax for months. They just do not do anything unless it becomes a real problem. He also told me that cryolife had notecard rip abilities and people knew about it. Some reported it, and others didn’t give a shit. Even I tested cryolife, which was first given to me by cryogenic blitz in bug island. It was fun as hell. But now he works for the emerald team which is a bummer. But LL is the cause for this, why the hell would they allow notecards to be distributed and modified by other people who aren’t the creator?
20. 

    I would also like to say
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    Neil tried to report the bugs in the system today and claimed he had nothing to do with it but said that other viewers had abilities to do these things.

    from http://neillife-lol.blogspot.com/2009/10/thank-you-everyone-i-kind-of-feel-bad.html

    He said he is doing a massive report on bugs.

    “ips in secondlife reveal(with a trick whether linden or not).
    “particle scripts can be ripped off of objects in seconds for example http://openmetaverse.org/viewvc/index.cgi/omf/libopenmetaverse/trunk/Programs/examples/TestClient/Commands/Prims/ExportParticlesCommand.cs?view=markup

    Particles can be ripped and injected back into objects too.

    anims- LL has a bad ability of stuffing .anim and other animation in the cache. One hack is to directly upload it from there. For anyone creating viewers if you look at llappsviewer.cpp you can prevent LL from removing the file extension from the cache prior to log out. Some viewers also have the ability to directly convert it to bvh file.

    Texture rip-> stored in cache too, file->save texture as(also in the normal viewer)(raw texture download). llFLoateravatartextures.cpp(also provided by LL if you check their source files, which basically allows texture ripping, if modding the .xml files, you can enable this option without coding). There is another set of freeuploading of texture which no one uses on the llfloaterreporter.cpp(raw texture uploading).

    sound rip-> stored as .dsf files in your cache but one can easily mod it to .wav. And can be ripped easily.

    guesture rip-> fails by permission system, any anim and sound can be dropped in there regardless of permissions. Just like clothing rip you can do guesture rip

    notecard system-> they fixxed perming wise. Not fixxed( people can mod no mod notecards but permissions are the same). There are still plent of bugs involved with notecards. Here is a tip of LL, in your server do not show text of a notecard if there is no permission(otherwise you enable other exploits).

    creator ids can still be forced(but LL has the ability to check last owner and orig_creator_id)which I found out when using an xfer trick but since its dead I do not mind mentioning it( I mentioned it to a few already not sure if they told people too).

    any sound or anim can be played by key (one of ur loop holes)
21. 

    LOL
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    @LINDEN LAB

    Change the name of your stupid little party to “BURNING SECOND LIFE” that is a more fitting title I think.

    I for one have actually been to the Burning Man Festival in the REAL WORLD. Your pathetic excuse to rip off some one else’s idea for a REAL LIFE party has just totally backfired on you. Good Luck with that SexGen Lawsuit, looks to me like you have just give Mr. Stroker all the evidence he will need to get MILLIONS out of you, and I hope he does!

    @Stroker Serpentine,

    SUE the MOTHER FUCKERS GOOD! use the money you get as start-up capitol to create a game where people’s idea’s, creations, Property and IP is protected. I am sure every single content creator on your list of exposed items will join you.
22. 

    Ari Blackthorne
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    Tenshi didn’t break any story. Dipwad Stroker whined like a crybaby as SL universe forums the way he usually does.

    http://commonsensible.net/2009/10/stroker-strokes-and-not-much-else.html
23. 

    Johnny
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    “SUE the MOTHER FUCKERS GOOD! use the money you get as start-up capitol to create a game where people’s idea’s, creations, Property and IP is protected. I am sure every single content creator on your list of exposed items will join you.”

    Good idea. You could call it “Galt’s Gulch”.
24. 

    Jimbo
    

    Oct 28th, 2009
    

    It’s obvious that this box of stuff is a plant. It had to come directly from someone own inventory. Hmmm… I wonder who would benefit from the hysteria that is generated?

    Anyway, LL should check its logs and see who actually rezzed the originals of the items. That’ll be the culprit. And LL should swing the banhammer on the owner for violating TOS. That’d be ironic. LOL.
25. 

    Content Tiger
    

    Oct 29th, 2009
    

    I’m going to have to agree with Anon…. “Intellectual property” is a shaky concept at best, and when it’s applied to an online games full of holes, it’s just a joke. I’m a builder and a designer in SL, and it never ceases to shock me how much some people seem to think their crap is worth. I mean, let’s be reasonable. Let’s say you create a pair of shoes that somehow aren’t a recreation of something in RL. Let’s say they combine clothing items and prims. Let’s even say that the shoes are seven prims apeice, and each prim uses a completely unique texture you uploaded. You’re looking at….. $140L for uploading the prim textures, and $10L more for the clothing-shoe texture. A few hours playing around, and you want…… what? $200L? Wouldn’t that be resonable? Make up for it all with one sale. Anything after that, pure profit. But…… Why do I see a $400L price? $800L? And people wonder why assholes steal it? I, myself, sell textures I upload….. at $2L apiece. Sure, I’m not gonna break even at first, but I know people will be able to buy my stuff, and therefore will come back. With friends. Soon I’ve made more then three times what I’ve spent uploaded, because I’m not a greedwhore. Most of my stuff may not be up to Bare Rose quality, but it’s not newbie freebie crap, either. I never ask for more then what it costs to make, and I keep my head above water…. so what is the big deal? Frankly, if you’re going to do anything on the net, you’re a fool if you believe you have privacy, or if you believe everyone is going to play by “the rules.” Sure, it may not be nice, but if people put half as much energy into adjusting to life instead of bitching that life isn’t what they want it to be, maybe there’d be less drama, more fun, and more things getting done. Me, I don’t care if anyone finds a way to steal my builds; I’m not trying to support myself in RL by playing a game. I like my RL. I also like sharing my stuff and sometimes having pocket-money to upload new textures or buy a new avatar. I dunno, maybe I’m wierd….. I remember when SL was about meeting other people, using imagination to make your own worlds, and learning from others, not trying to one-up everyone in the club by having the latest, brand-name scripted strap-on dildo.
26. 

    Senban Babii
    

    Oct 29th, 2009
    

    @Content Tiger
    “I remember when SL was about meeting other people, using imagination to make your own worlds, and learning from others, not trying to one-up everyone in the club by having the latest, brand-name scripted strap-on dildo.”

    QFT
27. 

    Debi Dastardly
    

    Oct 29th, 2009
    

    And I so agree with Content Tiger, you say everything I think and feel so well.
28. 

    Atra Lupis
    

    Oct 29th, 2009
    

    Stroker, there isn’t a single company around that truly gives a shit about “protecting” a person’s IP beyond the usual CYOA methods.

    Now then … If you are truly serious about protecting the work of others, cease using any scripts, animations, textures and prim constructs made by anyone that left or was “fired” before this year. I’d suggest before you decided to Trademark your brand of wares and attempt to Copyright virtual items that contain code, animations, textures and prim constructs that YOU DID NOT MAKE BY YOURSELF, but I am unsure of the date you filed for Trademark/Copyright.

    Regardless, I do not care if you have made anything on your own or not: The fact that you have used (and possibly continue to use) content that you did not create and do not have a verifiable contract to use in perpetuity, regardless of the status of those who allowed you to use the content at all … Well, this alone shows that you do not give a rat’s ass about the IP rights of others.

    Drop the act and the bull shit lawsuit, send out a formal apology and clean up your act.

    Any attempts to rationalize your actions, use of content that does not belong to you/was not created by you, presentation of “logs” giving “permission” to use said content or any other method of blowing off or otherwise attempting to male this post into nothing will be met with laughter and be considered proof positive that you are a simple asshole and only here to make a buck, no matter what.
29. 

    Jumpman Lane
    

    Oct 29th, 2009
    

    @ Ol Strok his dam self! hehehe maybe you didn’t GRASP that i meant the asset uuid of the skins that guy Chelsea Malibu created using the gl intercept, NOT theassest uuid of that crapinthat box at burning life . You know Chelsea Malibu don’t ya! I unno if them turds were lying or not but they never should lied to kick it with me! Let a Linden sort it out! hehehehehe. That’s my motto for the Twenty-ten! I would make some new beds if I were you.
30. 

    Vivienne
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    By reading some of the comments here i finally figured out the reason for SL being doomed to fail: It´s crowded by a bunch of arrogant, selfish, ignorant, stupid, self loving and extremely shortsighted bastards.

    OK, all you who obviously enjoy content theft and bash honorable ppl like stroker : One morning you´ll wake up and all the content in your inflated inventories created by anyone else but dilettant amateur rippers (as you obviously are) will be vanished, cause every major professional creator in SL will have blacklisted all the stuff. Oh yes, BIG complain, BIG disappointment, BIG outrage then! Is this what you want? Making the professionals leave so your very own majesties can serll their ugly malfunctioning trash for 10 lindens to brazilian noobs without any competition? Go ahead. kill second life. A world inhabited by idiots like you is not worth a second of existance.
31. 

    Anonymous
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    @ Vivienne

    I beg to differ but its already dead. All the fun, creativity, and brilliance has been killed off by greed mongering morons like you!
32. 

    Debi Dastardly
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    @ Viviene: Professional? Professional what Plumber? sorry my sl sink doesn’t stop up that often, Lets be honest about this if Stroker or anyone else leaves sl they really wont be missed for long someone else will come along and make better than they did it isn’t hard to figure out how to do you know. And the following statement is how most normal people see these people who file frivolous lawsuits trying to cash in on something and get more than they really put into it or deserve. (SL being doomed to fail (It´s crowded by a bunch of arrogant, selfish, ignorant, stupid, self loving and extremely shortsighted bastards.) That is exactly the kind of people I’m mentioning here and yes they should read the TOS learn it understand it know it well and if they don’t agree please STFU and leave its a game you know for fun!! do we still remember what fun is hmmmm? Go back to being plumbers I kept my day job always will I don’t live in a virtual world.
33. 

    Atra Lupis
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    @viv: Get off you fucking high horse and use your god damn brain.

    I’ve got no problem with people protecting what they have made. I do have a problem with twits like Stroker who use people to create content, do not compensate them with a perpetual cut of the profits and then toss them aside AND continue to use their content in their products!

    I have a problem with the twits who use lawsuits as a weapon, knowingly harming EVERYONE in the pursuit for a fast buck. Sorry, you do NOT file a lawsuit (like the one Stroker has) over computer data that you DO NOT EVEN HAVE A COPY OF ON YOUR OWN HARD DRIVE, let alone data that makes up a Second Life object! Has anyone even THOUGHT about what would happen if such a lawsuit forced Linden Lab to shut down?

    No.

    The “winners” would get their money, lose their business and be responsible for EVEREYONE losing their businesses, inventory, any cash still in the system … EVERYTHING.

    And guess what viv?

    There isn’t a court in the world that can order all of those assets to be returned to their “owners”.

    The cash? It went to fund the lawyers and to the “winners” of the lawsuit.

    The computer data? It belongs to Linden Lab: it is on their servers after all.

    So, no: I’m not going to support the morons who actually think like Stroker does. Anyone who is concerned about Second Life, their business or even something as mundane as their inventory … should do the same.

    People like Stroker should be forced to shut down their business, refund everyone that bought from them, pay anyone they used to get where they are … and then executed.

    Wat to protor content? Good! Do so without filing these bullshit lawsuits, without harming innocent bystanders, do it WITHIN the system.

    Otherwise you’re nothing more than the next Fast Buck Stroker.
34. 

    Vivienne
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    “…if Stroker or anyone else leaves sl they really wont be missed for long someone else will come along and make better than they did it isn’t hard to figure out how to do you know”

    Oh, dear, if it´s not so hard to figure out, why the hell aren´t you rich???? Come on…admit it, your envy is breathtaking. Please go home and align some boxes correctly (without a gap).

    “..is how most normal people see these people…”

    yeah, you obviously are “normal”. Stroker is not. This is why Stroker is successful in a pretty revolutionary medium and business, and the “normal” peeps still try to align boxes. You are such a BORE.

    “…they should read the TOS…”

    International copyright law is not a matter of a freaky ToS invented by a freaky little software garage at SF. Linden Lab should read these laws, which clearly override anything as ridiculously off this world as this “ToS” crap is.

    “its a game you know for fun!”

    Oh, is it? If it is for you, why do you bother to post your “opinions” here? Go back home and align some boxes, please, and leave the ones who worry about Second Life alone. Or did you steal these boxes?

    “twits like Stroker who use people to create content, do not compensate them with a perpetual cut of the profits and then toss them aside AND continue to use their content in their products!”

    AHHHHH! Why the fuck don´t you sue stroker, dear? I am sure that there will be a judge who´ll take care for your compensation, if you can prove your accusations. Is there a lawsuit running? OHHH….NO….so WHAT?????

    A ridiculous bunch of idiots. Period.
35. 

    ichabod Antfarm
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    I Wat to protor content but I’m not sure how to protor it. Is that a linux thing?
36. 

    Professor C
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    Interestingly enough it takes a while to verify and get into the Stroker Serpentine side of everything. So to look deeply into all that is in the SexGen scandal it was hard getting into the groups to start chatting and asking questions. And I found out a few things.

    @ Jumpman Lane

    You’re smarter than I first gave you credit. Lets start there. You are correct in that Chelsea and Cheergirl were behind the Redgrave skin theft. What you missed on that was that Stroker himself had copies and was passing them out knowing exactly where they came from.

    @ Vivienne

    Honorable people and Stroker Serpentine is two things that are not associated with each other unless you are stating that Stroker has screwed over many Honorable People. Atra is correct. Stroker does and continues to sell animations he did not create in a business model that he did not start. All from smooth talking and dealing. I am sure that Atra here has a part in everything and has had things stolen by Stroker as well.

    @ Strokers Supporters

    You are backing up the biggest content thief in Second Life History. You are backing a man that has had his account suspended not once not twice but THREE TIMES for fraudulent activity. I wonder if he thought about his suspension from SL from selling Linden Made animations as his own work back in his early days when he filed this lawsuit?

    @ Atra Lupis

    I have to ask. Are you a part of the Depoz (Formerly Home Depoz) group of builders that he promised to pay a cut for the Shower set and Desk set that he is still selling? Just Curious.
37. 

    icallbullshit
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    Vivienne my dear,

    Seriously you aren’t taking all this so serious that your neglecting your RL day in and day out responsibilities. Are you? I only ask b/c it looks like you are about to blow a f**king gasket. Chill down. It’s not real, it’s cartoon blah blah blah…

    (concerned citizen for the cartoon challenged)
38. 

    Deadlycodec
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    @Atra Lupis

    Dude, did you seriously suggest that someone should be executed for filing a lawsuit against the lab for their e-stuff? I mean, I think the whole thing is dumb as shit, but you realize you’re basically saying someone deserves to die over inconveniencing people in a video game? Get a fucking grip. It’s a game. I have no interest in getting involved in debates as to whether or not this litigation is founded or not – that doesn’t concern me at all. But FYI, I just thought I’d point out that absurd views like that are part of what makes SL so utterly fail.
39. 

    Viivienne
    

    Oct 30th, 2009
    

    Deadlycodec, it´s exactly what i find so extremely disgusting. These idiots use a very crucial topic, content theft, for fighting their little dirty war against stroker serpentine or whomever who dares to take legal action against a company which does everything but prevent anyone from stealing and ripping content big time.

    These idiot bastards do not realise that there are RL people who earn a RL income in SL, and who have valid existential interest. The cowardish “Don´t hurt LL, cause this MIGHT hurt SL and it might hurt our precious SL” is absolutely rediculous, considered the fact that every asset rezzed in-world is strictly public domain as long as LL does support the usage of hacked software and does not close the security gaps. And if this asset theft continues the way it recently erupted, then SL business and any kind of professional content creation will be dead pretty soon anyway, but NOT the company selling server space to the people who get all the ripped, copied and stolen assets for free.

    It does not matter at all if Stroker Serpentine or any other person made the scandal public, it was necessary to make it public and i would have done the same without hesitating.
40. 

    Jumpman Lane
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    Stroker Serpentine is the bggest content thiefin the history of Second Life PERIOD. (and prob using Vivienne as a nom de queer! hehehehe)
41. 

    Deadlycodec
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    Well, I contributed more than my share to IP theft in SL. That said, I think the lab has a problem. See, despite the wild rantings of people like Prokofy Neva, it isn’t any closer to being possible for the lab to prevent this sort of intellectual property theft. The data has to be sent to the viewer to tell it what to draw where, and the best they can do is try to devise a stunningly complex system for obfuscating it and make the client closed course. Additionally, they would need to change it ever so often in order to stay one step ahead of would-be attackers. This is the only feasible means for defeating the IP theft problem. The open source policy combined with the amount of documentation available, has rendered Second Life highly exploitable. This is an indisputable fact.

    On the topic of the third party viewer policy, the thing is laughable from the perspective of someone who knows a little about how things work. It’s generally going to be pretty unenforceable as far as the users of the software are concerned. They’re going to rely on some sort of signature detection system, the same type of system widely employed by IDS which is very flawed. It will detect signatures of known ‘illegal’ (in the sense of being against the tos) 3rd party viewers by means such as the way they ‘ping’ each other. Basically by strings of text, and possibly in later more sophisticated versions, response timing and so forth. The point is that signature detection is antiquated at best. Known signatures can be altered with trivial ease so as to evade detection. Developers of these viewers will just program them to mimic the official viewers more closely is all. The lab is positioning itself to go after the people who are hosting and distributing these viewers, however. That’s probably not going to work anymore than the MPAA has been able to eliminate movie piracy, Hosting will just move overseas to servers in countries with lax attitudes about IP rights such as China.

    The lab is going to be implementing some sort of system, I guess, if their blog is anything to go by, but I’m not betting on it stopping IP theft altogether. Lucky for me, the lab ran me off SL ages ago so they prevented me from wasting a whole hell of a lot of time on a virtual business. But I did spend a huge amount of time creating the stuff that I created up until my 3/08 ban as Adromor Wierwight, so I could understand how frustrating it would be to have someone steal that, I guess. This is an interesting and stunningly complex debacle, and I’ve been watching it with interest. The future of Second Life as a business platform really does hang in the balance. Is this data even copyright-able? There are a lot of very good questions that need to be answered, and some new precedents to be set.

    I wrote a huge screed on my blog called To Open Source Or Not To Open Source that discusses the pitfalls of security when open sourcing and the common misconceptions about it. You should check it out. Notice that while OSS advocates claim OSS is so much more secure, the US government is not open sourcing proprietary software used to access networks such as SIPRNET. Though many government networks like NASA may be insecure, don’t kid yourself, there are some very talented hackers working for the government. There is a reason that the mechanics of SIPRNET are not generally fully known, even to those that use it. In fact, not many know a whole lot about it at all.
42. 

    Debi Dastardly
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    @Viivienne:

    …Oh, dear, if it´s not so hard to figure out, why the hell aren´t you rich???? Come on…admit it, your envy is breathtaking. Please go home and align some boxes correctly (without a gap)…..

    Well first point why am I not rich who says I am not, Fact is you don’t know me period. And lets see I envy a former plumber who manages to put together a few prims in a cartoon world. Big deal and who cant, the problem here is this not all the prims he sells did he line up himself.

    …yeah, you obviously are “normal”. Stroker is not. This is why Stroker is successful in a pretty revolutionary medium and business, and the “normal” peeps still try to align boxes. You are such a BORE….

    You seem to keep going back to lining up boxes correctly lol, funny Noob I was doing it since day one on sl it isn’t a trick or something that is hard to figure out. And yes I’m more normal than someone who sits around filing lawsuits over cartoon stuff in a cartoon world. Once again do what you know if your a plumber stay a plumber if your a good one don’t give it up for virtual hot air. And this bore caught your attention didn’t I lol.

    …International copyright law is not a matter of a freaky ToS invented by a freaky little software garage at SF. Linden Lab should read these laws, which clearly override anything as ridiculously off this world as this “ToS” crap is…

    Once again read it and comprehend it when you subscribe to sl you are nothing more than a subscriber if you don’t like it no one is forcing you to stay. International copyright law? on what a virtual sex bed that doesn’t even exist in reality. And something else you should pay attention to this is filed with a US court not an International one. Idiot

    …Oh, is it? If it is for you, why do you bother to post your “opinions” here? Go back home and align some boxes, please, and leave the ones who worry about Second Life alone. Or did you steal these boxes?…

    Yes it is fun for me and it will stay that way to despite the fact there are simple minded arrogant fools around like you. And the reason I post my opinions here is because its fun too FOOL and even a lot more fun when people who are perpetual whiners respond to me and don’t even have anything intelligent to say. But you do make me laugh. And once again you go back to the lining boxes thing again, and did I steal them? Im not sure if they are or not they kinda look like everyone else s they are plywood and .50x.50x.50 you know the more I look at these I think they must be hell everyone else has some just like them. Bye you simple minded twit
43. 

    Debi Dastardly
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    …It does not matter at all if Stroker Serpentine or any other person made the scandal public, it was necessary to make it public and i would have done the same without hesitating….

    Yes oh right you would have I sell your fail from here you are only jumping on a fellow whiners train after it left the station.
44. 

    Atra Lupis
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    @viv: Come off of it already. Stroker is littler more than the virtual version of the woman who sued McDonalds after she spilled hot coffee on herself.

    Both are in it to make a fast buck.

    Both deserve to be laughed at, forced to compensate the companies they wasted the time of, forced to compensate the american tax payers for wasting the court’s time, forced to (in the case of Stroker) refund every asset ever sold in addition to giving due compensation for every asset he has ever used to make his virtual items, then executed so that they cannot spread the genes that allow for such fross stupidity to spread farther.

    Like I said, I have nothing against legitimate concerns and reactions by those looking to protect their ideas. I DO however utterly detest people who lie, cheat, steal, play with the feelings of others and abuse the legal system … all to make a dollar.

    Truth be told I also have something against those who would be so stupid as to depend on Second Life for their income. To do such is to depend on a web host that could go belly up at any time for said income.

    Filing a lawsuit over Second Life content is NOT a legitimate response or action concerning the protection of an idea. There is no “might harm” in the end result viv. Such a suit WILL harm everyone else and it IS being done in the name of making a quick buck.

    Instead of attacking anyone that dares to call Stroker’s lawsuit what it really is, why don’t you sit back, dig up all the facts, do a bit of thinking as a general user, do a bit MORE thinking as a NORMAL person (meaning someone who actually treats Second Life business as a hobby, not as a real source of income) then come back and comment?

    @Codec: Stroker is nothing more than this years version of the twit woman who sued McDonalds over a cup of hot coffee. The lawsuit is just as much a waste of time, money and the epitome of the fast buck, sue happy mentality that truly needs to be eradicated.

    Idiots like those two are the reason we have warnings on coffee cups telling us the contents may be hot, they are the reason,in fact, for each and every idiotic sounding warning on just about any product out there.

    You know the type I am talking about: Warnings that anyone with even a shred of common sense simply do not need.

    People like them do not need to be protected, they need to be shot.

    @Professor C: Nope, I’m just an average user who actually has a brain and an innate hatred of morons.
45. 

    Vivienne
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    “Stroker Serpentine is the bggest content thiefin the history of Second Life PERIOD.”

    And his cock is ten times bigger than yours! Yummi!
46. 

    Jumpman Lane
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    I personally thought this was all a publicity stunt to sell more sexbeds (but stroker ain’t makin more sex beds so my spies tell me). So, it must be all to promote his dream (since 2000) ofcreating HIS OWN virtual world Eros 3-d, coming feb of the twenty-ten!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Stroker_Serpentine&oldid=317281416
    though them wiki people deleted his advertizment there caws its been adream for a longtime and aint dunno yut!
    (who makes their own wiki page anyhows. WHAT VANITY! We should edit it lol).
    @ Vivienne I mean Stroker quit sucking your own dick trick!
47. 

    Vivienne
    

    Oct 31st, 2009
    

    “People like them do not need to be protected, they need to be shot.

    @Professor C: Nope, I’m just an average user who actually has a brain and an innate hatred of morons.”

    You obviously are sick. Sick people like you, who crowd SL by the thousands, are one major reason for it´s forthcoming total failure. You are a disgusting, violent, idiotic and dangerous, not even worth any further comment, Get lost, lunatic.
48. 

    NoNeedaName
    

    Nov 1st, 2009
    

    On a “copy boted” object, if you modify just a single prim (it’s size for example) or add or remove a prim from a linkset, it’s not anymore the same object legally it’s not the same object, it’s a look a like…
    Also, before suing someone, be sure, it’s 100% the same object if you don’t want to get in trouble yourself.
    Plus, LL has no legal rights to search someone inventory…
49. 

    Damen Hax
    

    Nov 3rd, 2009
    

    In response to an earlier comment.

    I have never used the neillife viewer.
    DO NOT download the client.
    False claims on its official blog (lies) implies only one thing..
    the author can NOT be trusted.

    I really feel sorry for small people that have to hide, how sad.
50. 

    Bubblesort Triskaidekaphobia
    

    Nov 3rd, 2009
    

    I just want to toss in my two cents here: I have been using Damen’s HUD for years. His work and his advice has been an inspiration to me since back when I didn’t know the first thing about HUDs. Now I have made several HUDs and have worked with many open source projects. His open code has been used over and over on products that are sold on XStreet. He is one of the great innovators of SecondLife.

    If he did copybot this junk and was caught he would admit it. IF he did it he would not be stupid enough to do it with the Damen Hax avatar, which makes me think that he did not do it. Somebody did this to him because he is a respected member of the scripting and open source community. It’s sad but lately I have noticed that the scripting community has started to eat their own, what with the drama over 3rd party viewers and now this. Drama between camps has been flaring up a lot. The environment is getting downright toxic.

    Who would do such a thing to Damen, though? I don’t want to point fingers without knowing the facts, but if you follow this story back to Shopping Cart Disco, Stroker was the one who alerted the media about the copybotted items. He even made up a list of people who Damen supposedly “stole” from. How did Stroker find this box to begin with? Perhaps he or one of his buddies manufactured it and slapped Damen’s name on it to drum up publicity for whatever scam he is up to now? I’m sure Damen has his share of other enemies in SL who could do this to him, so I’m not accusing anybody of anything, I’m just saying Stroker looks suspicious to me.

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