Ex-Superhero on Woodbury, Griefing & JLU drama
by Alphaville Herald on 11/02/08 at 4:04 am
Pierce Kronos reveals he “left the JLU in disgust” in exclusive interview
by Proper Prim, staff writer
A great deal of controversy has been circulating around the Justice League Unlimited of late raising questions about how much is real and how much has been manufactured – is someone is trying to troll and defame the JLU? To learn the truth, I created an alt and went inworld and asked the JLU for interviews for some time before Pierce Kronos finally (hesitantly at first) came forward to talk.
I went into the interview with a long list of questions. Could the teen grid allegations have any merit? Is Kalel Venkman really an ‘unbearable power hungry fascist’ as some have described him? What is the purpose of the JLU? What part did JLU play in the Woodbury University situation and Tizzers Foxchase’s permanent removal from Second Life? Near the end of the interview, Mr. Kronos announced that he had ‘left the JLU in disgust’ but also made it clear that there are still those in the JLU whom he likes, respects, even admires and that he will in no way betray their trust by disclosing any sensitive information as Nikola Shirakawa, another former JLU member, once had.
After speaking at length with Mr. Kronos about work, life in general, griefing, Second Life, the PN and the JLU. Pierce seems to be a good guy and I am convinced that not all of the allegations circulating are true – and I suspect that the ones that are true have nothing to do with him. While Pierce wasn’t been entirely forthcoming about his reasons for leaving the JLU, I admire the fact that he has shown his enemies respect by keeping his quarrels private. It is unclear if Mr Kronos intends to continue endeavors as an anti-griefer from outside of the JLU or if he simply intends to settle down and live quietly – either way we wish him the best of luck!
Proper Prim: Are we seeing a decline in griefing lately and if so, what do you think is the cause?
Pierce Kronos: I believe there have been fewer instances of organized and multi-sim griefing since just before the holidays started. It been like, “Where did all the griefers go?” Still, with over 15K sims in SL and God(dess) only knows how many residents, there’s always griefing going on somewhere.
As to why the apparent reduction … the flippant side of me would say it’s because all the griefer boys and “girls” are still playing with the Christmas toys they got from Santa Claus and haven’t broken them yet. Seriousness aside though, I don’t have any idea why it appears to have lessened but I’m fairly certain it will return, if only from a new crop suffering through the growing pains of the maturation process. I would imagine the “decline” is due to various factors as opposed to just one thing or another. Those factors could include improved SL and GTeam protocols, more folks being educated on utilizing Abuse Report procedures, griefers being busy with school and mid-terms, others getting on with their lives, the threat of real life repercussions, that sort of thing.
Proper Prim: What sort of legal implications do you think griefers may face in the future?
Pierce Kronos: That’s really hard to anticipate as all this cyber world stuff is relatively new compared to the history of real life. I imagine there will eventually be continued transition of real world laws into the cyber world; things like harassment, obstruction, slander/libel, discrimination, fraud, and so forth. Denial of Service has financial repercussions as well so there may come more corporate vs individual suing. You also have to remember Linden Lab is based in the US, home of the lawyer and land of the law suit. Besides, you know politicians and lawmakers the world over are just itching to get their mitts on virtual reality so any excuse will become justified.
Proper Prim: What is the real story about the Tizzers Foxchase and Woodbury University situations?
Pierce Kronos: Well that question is gonna open a whole big can of worms especially considering the folks who comment to Herald articles on a regular basis and all the folks who have taken entrenched positions, as it were, either for or against Tizzers.
To understand my perspective, you have to realize I didn’t join the JLU until June of ’07 so I wasn’t really involved in the whole Woodbury thing as it was already ongoing. I didn’t get to know Tizzers personally until Aree and I started setting out the Perch in Cordova to hang out on, as well as meet and talk with folks in a casual setting. That would have been sometime in October, ’07 I’d guess because it was prior to the infamous Halloween debacle.
As you can well imagine, we used to get all sorts of folks stopping by to chat and visit and so forth; Tizzers, Alyx, Windowlic to name a few and, of course, various PN in day-old avatars. The latter weren’t too hard to spot because, let’s face it, how many one-day-old new residents even know Cordova exists, much less how to get there? Anyway, over time and several conversations, when we weren’t being griefed, trolled or otherwise harassed by various of the aforementioned day-olds, I had the opportunity to hear Tizzer’s side of things and what he/she was trying to accomplish. So I gave Tizzers the benefit of the doubt despite believing Tizzer’s attempts at griefer reformation were misguided.
Proper Prim: Before you go any further, would you go back a moment and give your perspective on the Halloween thing?
Pierce Kronos: Well, I thought it was an incredibly stupid and boneheaded thing to do. I know it’s been posted in comments on the Herald by numerous folks that he/she was merely trick or treating, blah blah, but I mean … really? Anyone with a brain knows Tizzers and buddies went over there to tweak Kal (Kalel Venkman) at his real life address and they were successful even though Kal wasn’t there.
I’ve also heard that Tizzers lead a “raid” on Kal’s house after “stalking” him, tried to intimidate his family members, etc, etc. What it really was, was simply was an unthought-out, bad idea by an immature 19 year-old (or however old Tizzers is supposed to be) who was lucky things didn’t get really out of hand. But, you know, who of us didn’t do incredibly stupid, boneheaded, unthought-out things when we were that young?
I think Kal’s initial anger at the tweaking was justified — I mean it’s one thing to hassle someone in SL, but it’s quite another to take things into real life and to a person’s residence. At the same time, Kal’s old enough and should be mature enough to recognize it for what it really was and to stop referring to it as a “raid.”
Proper Prim: Okay, back to the “griefer reformation”
Pierce Kronos:Right, well, Tizzers would talk to us about just different stuff though one time he/she was all bent out of shape about something and really pissed me off by saying we in the JLU just took orders from Kal and did whatever he directed.. I proceeded to inform Tizzers that Kal was not my general, not my boss and not my father, that each of us (then) in the JLU were individuals and responsible for our own actions or non-actions. One need only read the comments here in the Herald to see how everyone in the JLU is smeared with the same tar that’s constantly thrown at Kalel — you know, guilt by association. There’s a lot of that in SL and in real life too.
Anyway, after that, Tizzers and I seemed to have an uneasy truce. Now that’s not to say that Kalel and others in the JLU did or didn’t file abuse reports for various alleged things. I was never personally knowledgable of Tizzers doing anything wrong until January 1, 2008.
Proper Prim: What happened then?
Pierce Kronos: I filed an Abuse Report on Tizzers for disclosing, without permission, a private conversation between Tizzers and myself to others in Second Life. Within a couple of hours, Tizzers Foxchase was no longer in Second Life. Now it could be that AR was the one that put Tizzers over the top in cumulative “naughty” points and resulted in a ban, or it could be that Tizzers just decided to delete the account for some reason.
By the way, for your readers information, there are three levels of disciplinary action that may be employed by the Governance Team when they determine abuse has indeed taken place: a warning, suspension (1 to 14 days), and lastly, a ban. There is no difference between ban and “permaban.” Too many people call suspensions “bans” and thus call a ban, “permaban”. There’s also an Administrative Log out but that only lasts an hour, so it’s not really an action, more of a time out. I figure, since everyone says Tizzers was banned as opposed to deleting the account, that the Linden cumulative point system is what lead to the removal of that person from Second Life as bans are on a real person, not an account name.
Proper Prim: So you got Tizzers banned from Second Life?
Pierce Kronos: No, Tizzers is the one that got Tizzers banned from Second Life. As to anything else about Tizzers and Woodbury, you should ask someone else. Let’s move on.
Proper Prim: Does JLU really have a presence on the teen grid? Is there another explanation for the existence of the near identical group that was recently uncovered on the teen grid?
Pierce Kronos: There is none nor has been any presence of the JLU on the Teen Grid. As to an explanation, well, you should know that many in the JLU are well old enough to have children, including myself, children who could easily be on the Teen Grid themselves. I suppose younger members of the JLU could well have siblings in that age range also. As I understand it, that teen group wasn’t even active at the time of the “uncovering” otherwise I’d say have a Linden IM the owner to determine the truth in the matter. I’m sure the Lindens could trace the ISPs of anyone in that teen group and compare it to the ISPs of those in the JLU to objectively determine the matter. I wonder if those folks who were so anxious to point the non-retractable finger of accusation bothered to file AR’s on the JLU or just gloried in the insinuations.
Proper Prim: Does JLU generally encounter resistance from landowners and other ‘neutral’ parties?
Pierce Kronos: Some are pro-JLU, some are thankful for any help they can get, some are neutral, some don’t like the JLU, some are anti-JLU, but really … the grid is 15,000+ sims and growing and I’d say most landowners don’t even know the JLU exists. Of those that do know about the group, the range of opinion runs from praise to condemnation, from being griefers to vigilantes, to wanna-be Lindens, to a self-appointed police force, to a public service group, to a valuable volunteer resource. Some within the group and without see themselves as being heros. Take your pick.
Proper Prim: How do you view what you did? Were you a hero, a vigilante, a griefer?
Pierce Kronos: I really didn’t view it one way or another. All I did was what any other resident of Second Life is empowered to do — abuse report apparent violations of the Term of Service and the Community Standards, try to help educate folks on ways to protect themselves and to provide information to new residents that would ease their transition into a new experience. I will say I enjoyed ARing griefers, be they a day old or two years in world. By definition, griefing causes people grief and anyone who purposefully causes grief to someone else deserves whatever penalties are appropriate.
Proper Prim: What about someone who griefs a griefer?
Pierce Kronos: ::laughter:: I do my best to abide by ToS and CS, others have their own opinions of what’s acceptable. It’s Linden Lab’s platform, they get to decide the rules. If you disagree or don’t like them, either don’t log in or try to get them changed.
Proper Prim: Tell me about Maldavious Figtree who is rumored to have been a JLU member at one point
Pierce Kronos: All I know is I saw him at a couple of meetings, then he trashed a sim, admitted to it and was removed from the JLU. He was/is a scripter or something like that I think. I’m pretty sure he’s listed in the Brainiac database as having been discharged for cause.
Proper Prim: Have there been a few cases of drama within the JLU? What are the primary causes?
Pierce Kronos: Well, having just quit the JLU last week, I’m probably the wrong person to pose that question to. Still, within any group, real life, second life or otherwise, there’s the potential for drama; it seems to be human nature. As I tried to explain to Tizzers that time, the JLU is composed of individuals not clones, not soldiers, not employees, not children either. Individuals have their own views and opinions on things … even when they band together for a common goal or purpose. Some in the JLU, for example, believe in a strict interpretation of ToS and CS, others believe in a more casual, situational application. With such wide ranging views, conflict and associated drama occasionally occurs. Sometimes it’s handled well and sometimes it’s not.
Proper Prim: What can you tell me about the JLU’s standard operating procedures?
Pierce Kronos: I can tell you all about them but I won’t. I may have quit the JLU in disgust but that doesn’t mean I don’t believe in the public service aims and mission of the group. Plus, there are those in the JLU whom I like, respect and even admire for their commitment to their ideals and their efforts to help Second Life be a good experience for all. I am not going to put those particular folks at a possible disadvantage by revealing to all and sundry what can be very effective procedures.
Proper Prim: I take it there are those in the JLU that you no longer like, respect nor admire?
Pierce Kronos: Take it however you want. I was very specific in how I said what I said.
Kalel Venkman
Feb 11th, 2008
Who cares….
Alyx Stoklitsky
Feb 11th, 2008
LONG VERSION:
The only thing I feel a need to comment about in this article is this one sentence:
“Some in the JLU, for example, believe in a strict interpretation of ToS and CS, others believe in a more casual, situational application.”
The ToS, and in places the CS, are a pair of insufferable, suffocating documents that are designed to do little more than protect LL from having trouble with idiotic lawsuits.
They do not make SL a nicer place for all, as LL cons people into believing – all they do is give the crybabies a thumb to suck on, give the grudge-holders something to snitch on people with (Remember those snitches at school? And how none of the other kids liked them?)
All they do is cover LL’s ass, make sure that they can fuck their customers however they like, and stifle creativity, diversity and culture.
In the case of Tizzers, of all of her bans, the majority have been for ‘disclosure’ – ie: pasting chatlogs within SL.
Disclosure.
An action so simple as repeating what someone else said. “PERSON A TOLD ME THIS”. This is disclosure.
According to LL, this a bannable offense. If you tell someone something that another person said to you, then that person can successfully report you for abuse – something MASSIVELY exploitable when you want to be rid of a given individual.
Relaying what one person has said to someone else is a vital part of communication! How many times do you do this in SL? How many times do you tell one friend what another person has said to you?
And the content of what you ‘disclosed’ is virtually irrelevant – no matter how innocuous the disclosure, an abuse report from the individual(s) whose text you are pasting will get you banned.
Pissed off anyone recently? Better not paste anything they’ve said – sure, they may be acting friendly now, but would they still pass up the opportunity to get you smacked with the banhammer? Maybe they’re just pretending to be your friend and waiting for you to do it!
Exploitable, no? A group of people watching someone’s every move and logging your every word could probably get ANYONE banned within a few months, if they really wanted to.
I doubt there is a single person in SL who does not commit dozens of acts of ‘disclosure’ daily! The only thing is that without an abuse report from the affected party, this type of disclosure is not bannable.
I have not bothered to ask what the exact nature of the text Tizzers pasted was, but I am quite certain that whatever it was, it was entirely inconsequential, and that the abuse report was filed with little more purpose than ‘upholding the ToS’ than due to any real suffering as a result of the disclosure.
SHORT VERSION:
Filing an abuse report is almost always a petty-asshole thing to do.
Witness X
Feb 11th, 2008
Would that same strict standard of ToS upholding apply to pronoun use? Several outspoken opponents of the JLU were known to use female avatars, including Tizzers Foxchase and Nikola Shirakawa. Did you file the proper Abuse Reports when you heard Kalel Venkman, or GreenLantern Excelsior, or Kara Foley disclose real-life information to the opposite? Funny how you over repeat Tizzers’ name with that interview. Afraid that using your real pronouns would reveal you for a hypocrite?
Jim Schack
Feb 11th, 2008
couldn’t agree more with Alyx.
Kalel Venkman
Feb 11th, 2008
The first post by me wasn’t me, once again – it was the person who seems to take delight in stealing my identity.
The real message here is that Pierce is doing what he feels is the right thing to do, the way he sees it. You have to admire the man for the work he’s done while with the League, and for his convictions. I have learned that what counts is a man’s actions, not how somebody wants to spin the interpretation of them for their own ends. I have a feeling that as well as Pierce has done, the best is yet to come, and I wish him well.
Kalel Venkman
Feb 11th, 2008
The above Kalel Venkman is an imposter.
I’m the real Kalel Venkman.
I have no doubt that it’s d3adlyc0d3c trying to ruin my good name on SLH.
Pierce Cronos was a really worthless member. The only thing he was good at was causing drama at the group’s very foundation.
I am not interested in his babbling and ranting.
SqueezeOne Pow
Feb 11th, 2008
While I could give less than a complete shit about this subject I must say the article was written well. The questions weren’t retarded (within the scope of such a retarded subject, mind you) and it wasn’t just a cut and paste of a long ass “one incomplete sentence per line” conversation like most “interviews” in SL are conducted these days.
So as a recap, lame subject, good writing. Almost there SLH!
Kalel Venkman
Feb 11th, 2008
Actually, I’m the real Kalel Venkman.
Chav Paderborn
Feb 11th, 2008
Yeah, what is it with JLU and pronoun disclosure? Does it not count now that Foxchase is off the Grid or is that same old “insult by outing their gender” schtick?
The Real Slim Shady
Feb 11th, 2008
Would the real Kalel Venkman please stand up? please stand up…please stand up.
Witness X
Feb 11th, 2008
From my experience, it was largely an insult, as they were certainly not afraid to use the insults in grid against them. In fact, the words of Ms. Foley have gone something like “woman pretender lower than excrement.” Indeed, maturity ranks high amongst much of their commission.
Kalel Goldman
Feb 11th, 2008
/me stands up
I AM KALEL!
Peter Venkman
Feb 11th, 2008
I’m Bill Murray. Harold Ramis, Dan Ackroyd and I are planning to file a lawsuit for maliciously slanderous use of my famed Ghostbuster character’s surname. Please cease and desist from using the surname Venkman in your sloppy internet wank sessions, or we will pwn you with the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man while we take you for every penny you’ve ever made.
Kalel Venkman
Feb 11th, 2008
Any of Kalel Venkman’s comments within the comment section of the above article are most certainly not myself. I, in fact, have yet to write a comment for said article due to the fact that I have been pondering what I shall expel upon the comment box on this web page. I have since decided that I am not going to waste my precious time responding to the small-minded being that is Pierce Kronos, so I assure you, I will not be posting further comments to any articles pertaining to such a person.
Also, I have an upsetting confession to make. I notice that the intellectually-challenged people (everybody) of Second Life are unable to read most of my comments. Yes, it is true, I am very bombastic, and I intend to use that skill only to confuse my enemies. The thing is, I don’t truly understand the definition of most words I write, and my seemingly large vocabulary that I tend to utilize in the majority of my comments is actually not in existence. I have only to thank the writers of Roget’s Thesaurus, and Mr. Roget himself. Rest in peace, Mr. Roget. I promise, as soon as I die I will float up to heaven and we can have the hot buttsex together that we have always dreamed of. I will be your Superman… all night long. Love forever, Kalel Venkman
A-Non-E-Moose
Feb 11th, 2008
Alyx, if you don’t like that “pair of insufferable, suffocating documents” that proscribe behavior in Linden Lab’s Second Life, then go somewhere else. No one is forcing you use Second Life, are they?
d3adlyc0d3c
Feb 11th, 2008
“The above Kalel Venkman is an imposter.
I’m the real Kalel Venkman.
I have no doubt that it’s d3adlyc0d3c trying to ruin my good name on SLH.
Pierce Cronos was a really worthless member. The only thing he was good at was causing drama at the group’s very foundation.
I am not interested in his babbling and ranting.”
I totally lol’d at this, since if you were kalel then you’d at least be able to spell Pierce Kronos name properly and not ‘Pierce Cronos’, as you put it. I’m pretty sure that everyone knows that I have no interest in smearing or trolling anyone anymore.
Witness X
Feb 11th, 2008
“Witness X” rename yourself to “Witless X”
You’ve gotta be a PNtard, you’re just a pretender like all the fake Kalel Venkmans.
Let’s get this record straight, no Witness X would ever side on the side of the PN or Chans. We might give them a very valid point here and there when they state one, but we never side with them.
All this pretenders are getting pretty old. Find a new trick. Then again I don’t except much originality or imagination from a PNtard, a Chantard maybe, but not a PNtard.
GreenLantern Excelsior
Feb 12th, 2008
“If you tell someone something that another person said to you, then that person can successfully report you for abuse – something MASSIVELY exploitable when you want to be rid of a given individual.”
There’s a way around this. Don’t commit disclosure. Easy, no?
“Filing an abuse report is almost always a petty-asshole thing to do.”
The petty actions are committed by the griefers, not those who write the Abuse Reports. Reporting them is a public service that benefits everyone.
“Several outspoken opponents of the JLU were known to use female avatars, including Tizzers Foxchase and Nikola Shirakawa. Did you file the proper Abuse Reports when you heard Kalel Venkman, or GreenLantern Excelsior, or Kara Foley disclose real-life information to the opposite?”
I did make the mistake of disclosing that Nikola was male one evening during a voice chat. Nikola overheard this and asked me not to commit this disclosure. I was lucky that he didn’t write an AR on me, and I’ve never committed disclosure in-world since then. It’s a bad habit, and it’s against the rules, so we shouldn’t be doing it. As for pronoun use, I’ve never heard Tizzers on voice chat, so I have no idea whether the avatar’s pilot is male or female. Using the word “Tizzers” instead of “he” or “she” only makes sense in this situation.
“Pierce seems to be a good guy”
He sure is. Thanks for the great article.
anonymous
Feb 12th, 2008
So, GLE, you guys exchanging chat logs between each other and chat logs of others considered fair game? Having a database that logs chats and other info, sharing them with tons of members is an exception to disclosure?
Technically your group is breaking CS and the ToS every day.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
HAHAHA DISREGARD THAT, MY ENTIRE EXISTENCE IS DEDICATED TO SHAKING MY E-FIST AT THOSE RASCALLY NOGOODDOERS THAT LEAVE DONGS ON MY E-LAWN.
Aree Lulibub
Feb 12th, 2008
“So, GLE, you guys exchanging chat logs between each other and chat logs of others considered fair game? Having a database that logs chats and other info, sharing them with tons of members is an exception to disclosure?
Technically your group is breaking CS and the ToS every day.”
I’ll answer for GLE. The JLU has no database that logs chats and as far as I know, while I was a member at least, there aren’t chat logs shared with the rest of the group. What would be the purpose or benefit? Your information is incorrect.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
I never took the side of these channer fucks. They’re fucking retards, but that doesn’t mean Kalel is good just because they don’t like him. I didn’t endorse PN or chan statements, just denounced JLU statements. There’s a difference that anyone with more than the intelligence of a rotten pig turd could see.
GLE, that’s really the only time you disclosed liek that? Well then what the fuck do you call this:
/quote
As for Nikola Shirakawa, he (not she) is an ex-JLU member who posted that he was planning to hang himself. Then, two days later, he came online and ejected everyone from the groups he owned. Check his profile now and you won’t see any groups, so you won’t be able to use the group information to see the last time he logged in. There’s a good chance that when he talked about hanging himself, he meant he was going to abandon his Nikola avatar and start over as someone else. And he had nothing to do with the teen grid.
/quote
Remember that comment you made here:
http://foo.secondlifeherald.com/slh/2008/02/oped-the-sl-her.html
Now not only is that making you a liar here, but, as it clearly takes place after your named example, you do so knowingly. Get your ass back off that altar.
Oh sure, maybe it doesn’t technically break the rules, but is that really the kind of lawyering people who call themselves role models would support? Just because you may get away with something doesn’t make it right. Now, I’ll pause so you can call me an alt and/or claim you’ve been sockpuppeted.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
Hell, you managed to disclose right in the post saying it was a mistake. Ladies and gentlemen, the king of the retards!
And if you see a female face in front of you, it is in fact, proper to use feminine pronouns. The fact that you would do otherwise shows that you know something else to be the case. No one looks at a girl and says, “Well she MIGHT be something else, so I’m going to watch my words.” They use what comes naturally. You jsut painted yourself into a nice green little corner there.
What makes you so sure there are no abuse reports against you?
Kalel Venkman
Feb 12th, 2008
It doesn’t seem as though there IS any real Kalel Venkman posting these days. He’s looking like just another victim.
Why Bother
Feb 12th, 2008
All these comment posers are proving the points of those who they are pretending to be, the real one says that they didn’t make a comment and then in comes the flood of pretenders.
How can one have a debate on anything if anyone can pose and pretend to be another?
This is proof enough that the SLH’s Typepad comment system is broken. I stated before this how the Herald likes it, since it perpetrates bad blood and makes everyone hate and bash each other, exactly like the Herald’s “journalists” themselves.
Aree Lulibub
Feb 12th, 2008
Darlin’s, posting stuff in the SL Herald from Second Life is not disclosure. The Herald doesn’t have to abide by SL’s TOS or CS.
A-Non-E-Moose
Feb 12th, 2008
OK, let’s be clear about Nikola’s gender: Nikola disclosed Nikola’s gender to the world when he posted his RL pic in his First Life profile. He also started SL as male and for the longest time was seen in exclusively male avatars. It is only in, say, the last half of his Second Life that he hid his gender and switched to a female avatar. That ain’t disclosure, for most who know him its just history.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
Aree Lulibub, you and the rest of the JLU claim to be role models for the rest of the grid. Do you have any idea what that means? It means you are supposed to hold yourself to a higher standard, which you claim you do, and while this may not technically be against the rules, a truly decent person would at least have the respect to honor thier privacy. I won’t go to jail for keeping a wallet filled with money, but that doesn’t make it right.
Tizzers was permabanned for disclosure resulting from the real-life attempt to scare Kalel’s family. That was technically out of the jurisdiction of the ToS, but you and your teammates sure didn’t let that stop you. You post notices about cyber crime to keep people from looking into your private business, but you don’t feel you should do the same for others?
Pot, meet kettle. You two have much to discuss.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
“Tizzers was permabanned for disclosure resulting from the real-life attempt to scare Kalel’s family. That was technically out of the jurisdiction of the ToS, but you and your teammates sure didn’t let that stop you.”
Ah, nice try Witless X (you’re not a true Witness or NoName anyways I bet you’re the same one pretending to be Kalel Venkman too). Tizzers used Second Life to plan his little trick or treat escapade to Kalel’s house. I’ll repeat that again incase you are dense, Tizzers used Second Life to plan his trip to Kalel’s house. He had to get a small group together, he had disclose Kalel’s RL address and much much more. So techically HE WAS in Linden Lab’s jurisdiction.
I also find it funny that no one ever touches how Tizzers fraud schemes. Tizzers is always innocent, his hands are always clean. Complete and utter bullshit.
Penance Sautereau
Feb 12th, 2008
To A-Non-E-Moose – Nikola identified as a transgendered woman and publicly said so. The JLU knew this. Those among them who insist on calling Nikola “he” do so solely to belittle her by intentionally disrespecting the identity she identified as. Not all JLU are this smug and prejudiced, but the few who are happen to be the loudest and most outspoken. And now for all they know their insistance on belittling her means she’s hanging forgotten in a closet somewhere.
Just compassion.
*snort*
GreenLantern Excelsior
Feb 12th, 2008
“Oh sure, maybe it doesn’t technically break the rules…”
If the rules haven’t been broken, then there’s not a problem. From the Second Life Community Standards:
“Remotely monitoring conversations, posting conversation logs, or sharing conversation logs without consent are all prohibited in Second Life and on the Second Life Forums.”
Note carefully the words “in Second Life.” The Second Life Herald is not “in Second Life.” Anything that happens “in Second Life” is fair game for discussion outside of Second Life. And if you see me committing actual disclosure “in Second Life” from now on, please feel free to write an Abuse Report on me. I will have deserved it for breaking the rules. We can call that the “Witness X Challenge” if you like.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
It does not matter if it was ever said to anybody. If there is no standing public record, it is disclosure.
On the note, though, how would you be that familiar with his history? You must be a former friend, and to turn against her like that, you would most likely be JLU yourself.
Anonymity only works when you don’t overplay your hand, kiddo.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
“It does not matter if it was ever said to anybody. If there is no standing public record, it is disclosure.
On the note, though, how would you be that familiar with his history? You must be a former friend, and to turn against her like that, you would most likely be JLU yourself.
Anonymity only works when you don’t overplay your hand, kiddo.”
You really are dense. You have no idea how disclosure works. Of course types like you, more than likely a PNtard, don’t quote rules when you’re breaking them but spout them out when they suit your fancy. You can’t have it both ways.
I am a true Witness/NoName, so give it Witless X and get a new name. We as a group do not endorse your brainless postings using our name.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
GLE, I never said it was against the rules to discuss it out of SL. I said for people who claim to hold themselves to a higher standard, delighting in such technicalities is hypocritical.
As for Tizzers, I’m not excusing her actions. I agree with Kalel’s sentiment that eh would have been within his rights to shoot the stalker bitch dead. But I have seen no proof it was planned in SL, other than they knew each other from SL. Flimsy proof, and to file abuse reports would have required vast amounts of such hearsay. Maybe she did do it, but the burden of proof falls on the accuser.
Aree Lulibub
Feb 12th, 2008
“Aree Lulibub, you and the rest of the JLU claim to be role models for the rest of the grid. Do you have any idea what that means? It means you are supposed to hold yourself to a higher standard, which you claim you do, and while this may not technically be against the rules, a truly decent person would at least have the respect to honor thier privacy. I won’t go to jail for keeping a wallet filled with money, but that doesn’t make it right.”
Dear Witness X. Because I stated a fact doesn’t mean that I have the poor ethics you describe. You don’t know me, have never spoken to me, so how do you know how I behave? Feel free to send me an IM in-world if you want to chat. For the record, I am no longer with the JLU.
“Tizzers was permabanned for disclosure resulting from the real-life attempt to scare Kalel’s family.”
Tizzers was banned (There is no offical term “permaban”) after her last disclosure. Did you read the article? It had to do with the cumulative points that she racked up with all her violations.
“Pot, meet kettle. You two have much to discuss.”
My conscience is clear and I sleep at night. How about you?
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
A True Witness X calls a liar and a hypocrite oru for who they are. The PN and the channers are ignorant, racist little bastards, who need to be thrown into the strictest of military schools, but that does not excuse hypocritical behavior on the part of the JLU people. Name one pro PN statement, I have made, you JLU Witness wannabe. A true Witness would not dodge a question or an accusation so easily, they would answer it and refute it properly, as I have done, and which you have failed to do. Witness X are not on the side of the JLU, the chans, or anybody. We call all charlatans otu for what they are, and the JLU are every bit as fucked in the head as their channer frenemies.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
The only disclosable things in Second Life are things that can be verified through public records, i.e. information displayed in Search. if you can prove that Nikola revealed these real life details about herself through her profile, or information that anyone may freely access within Second Life, then it is not disclosure. Otherwise it is.
Witness X
Feb 12th, 2008
I sleep with the clearest of consciences, but I truly deserve it. I don’t know your behavior but from your statements here. To call yourself a role model, then swim in the mud is hypocritical. I don’t know if you are still in the JLU, but I do know that you share the same faults as they do in this case. You people seem to be dodging the charge far too easily.
YOU ARE HYPOCRITES FOR CALLING YOURSELVES ROLE MODELS AND THEN ACTING SO CALLOUSLY AND JUVENILE WITH REGARDS TO PRIVACY.
You are not breaking rules, but you are still fuckwads for it. Tabloid journalists don’t break any laws, but that doesn’t make them saints.
Cam Mitchell
Feb 12th, 2008
Here’s some fun facts.
Rainey Paderborn is DianaPrince Carter and MissyA Price, from the Philippines, and has been raped. That’s a publically accessible fact.
Fenix Harbinger is from Dublin Ireland, and looks just like this:
http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Image:Lynncunningham.jpg
And Kalel Venkman, also known as Gene Turnbow has a single son named Charlie and a wife. His contact information may be freely downloaded from
http://kryptonians.net/turnbow_online_resume_files/onlineresume.htm?resume_id=225&key=26606b6af431120007c9d3131d31b8d8
Enjoy your facts, which were published with fully true and just ethical considerations!
Cam Mitchell
Feb 12th, 2008
To anyone else who wants to avoid this third-rate fucktards, simply load your scanners and banlists with the following information.
* “c40457e2-6e89-4bca-ab4e-d781db63616a”, // Amra Hosoi
* “3743d294-c91a-4b87-a09c-e12ef2425499″, // Angelica Nephilim
* “b7ec2e8c-0439-4f98-b47d-e3d3f22d8d2c”, // Arbre Trebuchet
* “203d2193-042c-4917-9f57-4c6441ef9a3b”, // Aree Lulibub
* “26248f64-a1e2-431c-8ef7-9edd5462ae18″, // Barbara Onomatopoeia
* “bdb13893-aebf-4777-bb7b-eccd8ea178ef”, // bartelby Pegler
* “a4afb071-8a49-488d-93f2-5a6c314ad3a6″, // Ben Lu
* “1f810fa2-8f19-48a0-bd77-eaada823726c”, // Brainiac Hax
* “f469a4d4-96eb-429a-b630-f231daa48992″, // Brutus Voss
* “206c29af-14e2-4d32-a499-d11065aad491″, // California Condor
* “ad5a3d70-5d52-4e8e-a26f-d019066ee06b”, // Carigorp Matzerath
* “22c1e6cd-b900-4290-b16f-6006a91bf010″, // Cebrix Hax
* “7c47e659-d203-4f41-b364-7d85181978e7″, // Clark Keats
* “774693e0-1d02-4bfc-a620-913d368ec2d4″, // Cole Chestnut
* “5ee7afc2-524b-4d8e-8d7e-5800c749ae7d”, // Connor Whitman
* “ea30f567-c32e-4637-9a2c-717a83cb1760″, // Damian Rigaud
* “258d0caa-980b-4425-b530-9d383d18b4d9″, // Dawg Shatzkin
* “7ee735f6-66e4-48a2-98c3-f0cc54e64c42″, // Dez Vega
* “8086e84a-6f8b-468d-b68a-763b6cb4b42f”, // DianaPrince Carter
* “6b53af6b-c69e-4257-8919-56fe27d498b1″, // Diovan Armistice
* “01971e1a-327b-4ec0-b62f-e10835a3096f”, // Dransen Hulka
* “af29371f-e695-438f-9e73-ce765272a635″, // Edav Nomad
* “70bac4f3-3815-45ba-9c4a-50dc52b2a998″, // Fenix Harbinger
* “ad400a85-16f4-4c9a-bd89-f7786bee3171″, // Flash Grelling
* “064fa7e5-4f0b-4a49-b371-e9b111c73303″, // Gawyn Philbin
* “b0271f95-b0c6-468e-8e66-4e3dbb574bdc”, // Ginrai Yamabushi
* “6c9021c0-b70c-401d-ac4a-4a60af8dd3fd”, // Glitch Braess
* “ea8771d0-09b3-43fd-8aaf-a23b3ca4063d”, // GreenLantern Excelsior
* “9aabf90c-b572-4628-8a9a-8cbb1a0ed7f1″, // GreyFox Book
* “c1f06e87-f17c-4ed9-b471-0e7e5ae4b992″, // Heidi Stiglitz
* “292c12a3-7689-420c-ad29-f80f2972dead”, // Hewee Zetkin
* “2f7c399d-c4ec-48ff-a8c8-9bcb378e92b5″, // Hunter Talon
* “1ca0e8a7-7333-48e7-bef2-5427ae015ff1″, // Ilsa Stine
* “d36261c9-22e0-448d-af7e-a648d40e49d9″, // Jeffrey Essex
* “d4130e83-4952-4783-a8a2-223230b39072″, // Jewelsy Walsh
* “13262ca6-b224-49ca-b4bd-d8b0607417d2″, // JonnJonzz Green
* “e0686d4f-caea-4e5b-9119-c6f1b55b6d75″, // Kalel Venkman
* “398d738a-6b70-4d47-ba27-7e3c6b3ceb04″, // KallfuNahel Matador
* “0c9b3193-7917-433f-ab39-68a68101d46e”, // Kara Foley
* “270067ef-ccfc-43a6-a7c7-2ed4ffef3ca2″, // Kara Timtam
* “254010d5-5b7f-44f9-8e4f-42b0605c493d”, // Katar Superhcarge
* “8800eed9-c5f3-46cc-ad90-a9ffeb6f7ca3″, // Lobo Nagorski
* “aec97cf9-c8b7-49bf-a46d-c97ee726d77b”, // Magnus Peterman
* “02d238fc-b5fd-499c-8a61-498c6cfc4c15″, // Meggye McLaglen
* “88d91b65-198c-45b6-ad61-f8d4e1d9dfa8″, // Mike Calhoun
* “661e1977-44ea-498e-b6ef-0308752e7ab2″, // Micheru Mathys
* “ef61bbe7-3af6-4066-95c7-c8495f22f333″, // Neon Serge
* “940bc687-875c-4fff-b220-595dbfe15727″, // Netwonder Widget
* “19d5108a-9735-4575-83b1-56a0734267c0″, // Nomore Weeks
* “7f2861b7-b165-4150-aa86-bc4f3a572e2e”, // Padishar Frobozz
* “70e7e775-6a9e-401b-b3eb-80615ddb858c”, // Pierce Kronos
* “72cbeabb-7cab-4cce-bc07-8f5847812eb4″, // Piper Craven
* “f7445cf8-fb2c-4f86-b534-cd83524845ca”, // Pyxel Courier
* “5bdf949d-1a35-4e7b-ade8-0528e21fbfc8″, //Quinstar Gremlin
* “437cfd4c-cc2c-404f-b006-4bcfb9596325″, // Ren Austinmer
* “dc697301-481d-469b-8b67-3d113a55da09″, // Rainey Paderborn
* “5bde5e9f-5629-4562-81eb-da1f0daa3a34″, // Rodimal Axon
* “02b25dfb-baae-4d93-b568-a823391c4576″, // Rose Zobel
* “165dfc55-fc29-4340-b462-bc3bb4834c64″, // Ryozu Kojima
* “c9c0c351-4591-4c3d-aba3-c8e9bb4daa34″, // Samantha Lowell
* “0db0dff4-ec34-4ca1-9532-67ca1dfa1ac6″, // Sapphire Holden
* “481587ad-6934-4631-9f98-0c79f4912e8d”, // Scotty Piedpiper
* “9a4532a9-ae9f-4de5-9468-c1028f2b80c8″, // Sean Petit
* “ec3ced8a-109a-4fe6-85cb-ba3fe646127c”, // Selene Hudson
* “b3873982-04ab-4eea-b0c4-4eb749bb9d5c”, // Sen Pixie
* “f2e59d34-c91a-4061-88dc-ebd8499f8546″, // Solo Petion
* “f4093348-bfff-4b6f-bd79-f2dda816e55d”, // Ssaspriina Sismondi
* “19872fe4-1494-4634-a58c-8dbb36fe9b0b”, // Superman Magneto
* “d651dde1-72a6-4e2f-88a5-744c3e0a2741″, // Ta Moxie
* “2c3bc9c7-6326-4f8b-92c0-32038d46d1e2″, // The Spearmann
* “8df2f7b3-4e69-4a62-b858-443f9a579440″, // Tracy Laszlo
* “80f51284-c485-4505-986d-dd42645ae501″, // Vidya Narayan
* “1c3c81d1-fa5b-4e2c-8253-a6098ac384cc”, // Wingless Redgrave
* “d125688e-e3f0-4fab-9bd8-ae2076ed88f3″, // Zania Turner
* “e24d84b7-9280-4c25-83e6-443c89342136″, // ZATZAi Asturias
* “3739ddae-97f4-48c8-ab41-eeaba21c3907″ // Zooey Zeno
At0m0 Beerbaum
Feb 13th, 2008
Okay, I didn’t want to step in, but witness X is full of shit.
I love how you all like polishing the same story over and over again and twist the truth a little more each time until it looks like it was justified.
I know Tizz, and if there was any planning beforehand, I would have known about it. I found out on the first of November like everyone else. They just did it all at random. I do admit it was pretty damn stupid to do. Especially when there were certain things on the line at the time. Oh well, people are people. This should have been dealt with IRL. Oh wait. “Justice” wouldn’t have been served “correctly” because the police would have laughed. Still, abusing the AR system to settle personal issues is very immature. This is the kind of crap that’s degrading the quality of SL. People go to the Lindens for EVERYTHING. Personal issue? Duke it out in private. The Lindens should be a last resort.
Also, this article doesn’t really say much of anything except Tizzers Foxchase’s final ban.
Just more troll material for the herald to get hits
Change the headline to “Ex-superhero talks about how Tizzers Foxchase got banned”
anonymous
Feb 13th, 2008
Hey witness X, ever been to a military school or been around military people? They’re some of the most foul mouthed, ignorant, hypocritical, and racist people you’ll meet. Just thought I’d point that out. I never heard people use the N word to describe a black person until I was with my dad at a military base where a general was making racist jokes
Also, most channers aren’t actually racist, they act that way to piss people like you off
Only ones who take it seriously are the retarded 13 year olds who want to be internet cool kids, but totally don’t get it. Hell, the original point of the PN was to troll Linden Labs for being “racist” because they started banning black avatars that were new because of their actions. Just like how with Habbo Hotel, you cant make a black avatar with a suit and an afro anymore. Dressing up as a stereotypical gang member is A-okay though! (in habbo and SL)
Stop taking the situation more seriously than it really is, it makes you look like a retard.
Witness X
Feb 13th, 2008
OK, now that’s over the lien to post details like that in a public forum like this. Seriously, that’s just deplorable. The Herald needs to delete this cam guy’s posts, as those are flagrant privacy violations.
Alyx Stoklitsky
Feb 13th, 2008
WAAAAH, WAAAAH, FILE AN ABUSE REPORT!!!
WAAAAH, WAAAAH, I’M TELLING MOMMIE!
Witness Y (do I even bother?)
Feb 13th, 2008
funny, this…
“Hell, the original point of the PN was to troll Linden Labs for being “racist” because they started banning black avatars that were new because of their actions. Just like how with Habbo Hotel”
The original point of the PN was to troll Habbo Hotel. The avatar suit & afro soon got a banned combination at Habbo Hotel because of groups of channers blocking the pools with those avatars. (hence, pools closed)
The point of PN in SL has nothing to do with LL. The first mention if it was a question if it would be raidable. And the only black AV that would ever get banned for being new, is the one in a three piece suit, wearing an afro, and shouting memes like pools closed and all that shit, while caught in the act of griefing. If anything, the PN only manages to draw a chuckle from the average linden. Perhaps excluded the poor guy or gal that has to go trough all bogus abuse reports from vigillante anti griefer groups.
If you are going to spin lies, dont do it about facts that PN and other channers have themselves been noting down so ‘proud’of their actions in Aencyclopedia Dramatica and can be verified by any idiot with a webbrowser.
In before BS about AE not being channers, but goons etc etc. You all interbreed. Quit with the infighting already youre all the same. Internet toughguys with nothing better to do with their time then pesker people over the internet. Grow the fuck up.
And for those who are still being ‘plagued’ by griefers, those of you that seem to think it takes something as retarded as a self appointed ‘police force’ in ffing LEOTARDS >.> (fucking hell man! Put on some PANTS! its a PG area!) to stop teh evil nasty griefers…
Grow the fuck up.
If someone shoots you with a pushgun… does it hurt?
If yiou have a screaming cube following you… are you really unable to just turn your speakers off?
If someone particlebombs you… are you too retarded to simply TP away?
Griefers really dont mean SHIT if you dont let them. Stop whining like a little baby and just shrug and move on. EVEN the PN themselves have been explaining this, giving a responce will make them come back for you, if you IGNORE them they will GO AWAY. They dont like boring victims.
Why are furries popular targets? cause they baaaaaaaawwwwwww. And that really, really is the ONLY reason. Why did Tizzers and her channer friends pay Kalel Venkman a visit at home? Becuase he Bawwwwwws harder then all furries on this planet combined, and has the stupidity to stand in the spotlight, AND be anti griefer (yay one that bawwws AND tries to fight back! interresting target!) AND has his RL information available on the internet. I’m no expert but I call that a seriously stupid move.
GRIEFERS, as well as a lot of other people keep telling you all, furries, whiners, Penny, Prok, how to end griefing for yourself. But you never listen, do you?
You’re all retards.
GreenLantern Excelsior
Feb 13th, 2008
“You are not breaking rules, but you are still fuckwads for it.”
Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me. I suspect you would call us names just because we’re JLU members anyway, so your insults are meaningless.
“Enjoy your facts, which were published with fully true and just ethical considerations!”
So it was found on the Internet and you reposted it elsewhere on the Internet?
* shrugs *
You would get the same reaction if you heard something in Second Life and then published it on the Internet. If people make their information available in public, then it becomes available to be repeated in public. This is getting a litle silly, don’t you think?
anon
Feb 13th, 2008
The “just want attention” model of internet trolling doesn’t fit the PN, “Witness Y”.
You are indeed correct about the original question. It was a thread on 7chan /i/ (before it turned into furfaggotry) where someone asked if we had any presence in Second Life, essentially the entire thread said “no it can’t be done” and a couple guys decided to do it anyway..me, Zuki, and Lynch being the ones to do it, with a couple people I won’t name that were in SL for a while that gave us the first tools we needed.
The fact is, the pool was raided because it was there. SL was raided because it was there. The very thing that makes SL SL – an imitation of real life – invites a srs bsns immersive mentality that makes griefing so effective. I know that I wouldn’t care if a furry sim gave us attention, we’d hit it anyway. Sure, the media stuff was fun but we got “lols” from our own actions.
P.S. The PN didn’t exist as a group in Habbo Hotel. The name, Fort Longcat, etc only came about after we began our activities in SL. The term “nigra” was descriptive of the black-and-in-suit avatar in Habbo, but there was no “P” in it until after the GYC got blocked with american flags.
Cee Ell
Feb 13th, 2008
Nobody has to dissect the alleged Tizzer activities to justify a permanent closure of that account. The TOS 2.6 says, quite simply, “Linden Lab has the right at any time for any reason or no reason to suspend or terminate your Account, terminate this Agreement, and/or refuse any and all current or future use of the Service without notice or liability to you.” It’s hardly surprising that Linden Labs chose to rid themselves of a relatively high-profile ‘customer’ that shows up unbidden and unwelcome at another customer’s home — for whatever purpose. No appeal to Community Standards is necessary.
As for griefing in general, ‘serious business’, ‘lulz’, and ‘get over it’ — maybe that’s cute in the virtual worldview, but over here in RL it’s much the same as some asshole stealing my newspaper out of the tube at the street, or jamming my radio reception. It’s a theft or interference with the use of a legitimate service – in this particular case, a paid service.
anon
Feb 13th, 2008
The “just want attention” model of internet trolling doesn’t fit the PN, “Witness Y”.
You are indeed correct about the original question. It was a thread on 7chan /i/ (before it turned into furfaggotry) where someone asked if we had any presence in Second Life, essentially the entire thread said “no it can’t be done” and a couple guys decided to do it anyway..me, Zuki, and Lynch being the ones to do it, with a couple people I won’t name that were in SL for a while that gave us the first tools we needed.
The fact is, the pool was raided because it was there. SL was raided because it was there. The very thing that makes SL SL – an imitation of real life – invites a srs bsns immersive mentality that makes griefing so effective. I know that I wouldn’t care if a furry sim gave us attention, we’d hit it anyway. Sure, the media stuff was fun but we got “lols” from our own actions.
P.S. The PN didn’t exist as a group in Habbo Hotel. The name, Fort Longcat, etc only came about after we began our activities in SL. The term “n-igra” was descriptive of the black-and-in-suit avatar in Habbo, but there was no “P” in it until after the GYC got blocked with american flags.
Witness X
Feb 13th, 2008
Once again, GLE, you dodge your charge all together by select quoting. I wouldn’t speak ill of you just for being JLU, as I have seen a few of you that actually did use a bit of decency. However, you personally, have proven you deserve no respect, as you seem unable to give it. You were asked flat out, by your own admission, not to refer to Nikola with masculine pronouns. You have been told time and time again that it is rude and hurtful to refer to transgendered individuals in such a way, yet simply because you are not breaking any official rules, you chose to do so anyway. So yes, I will call you a fuckwad, because that is precisely what you are for demonstrating such a noticeable lack of class and decency.