PaleFire’s Open Letter to Kalel Venkman
by PaleFire on 21/08/11 at 8:18 pm
Have griefers turned the JLU into a paranoid collective?
When I approached Peter Ludlow at the Society of Cinema and Media Studies in May 2010, I never would have guessed that my research would cause so much concern among anti-griefing organizations, and by that, I mean specifically Kalel Venkman. Here’s why I am writing this post now, even though I have been conducting my research on griefers since 2006. Apparently, warning notices were sent out to the "Proactive Security" group about me today:
A Reminder - do not interview with Defne Demar
She claims to have only weak ties to the Alphaville Herald, the griefer apologia tabloid run by Pixeleen Mistral, but the truth is that she's in so deep with them she's almost out the other side. She's working on a book for Peter Ludlow, whose only aim is to glorify griefers. Anything you give her will not be used for good.
Best advice is to refuse to talk to her, or mute her if you'd rather not be bothered by this person. You all know me well enough that I never say something like this lightly.
Kal
Let’s back up a bit. When I started my research on Second Life, I was a graduate student writing my dissertation on cross-media storytelling. I thought it would be neat to include the disruptive narratives that griefers in Second Life generate as an example of vernacular creativity. At the time, Voted5 had just got banned and all the usual suspects were hanging out at the #SL IRC. So I hung out at the IRC, but also went to SLCC 2006 to establish some contacts and meet the community at large. All were welcoming and friendly. I am grateful to have them as my friends. I started hanging around in Baku and try to connect with the W-Hat - with mixed success. No surprise there.
Some acted like horses ass, pretended that they were giving me “false” information, while others (like Masakazu Kojima and Decomposing Monstre) were genuinely interested in giving me information about how they build/create/generate stories in this virtual environment such as Second Life.
I went back to SLCC in 2007 and 2008 and gave papers on the griefing subculture. Right around the time when I was ending my field work, I was able to establish contact with the PN and talked to their leader, Frizzlefry, who again was (and still is) genuinely interested in answering my questions about their organization and their raids. He introduced me to a bunch of their members in their IRC so I can talk to all of them.
Around that time (June 10, 2008 to be exact), I e-mailed Kalel Venkman to ask for an interview and he told me to e-mail him my questions and he’d be happy to answer them. I sent him my human subjects consent form (as required by the IRB-the human subject’s bureau) and waited for him. He sent me the following e-mail the very next day explaining the goal of his organization and some comments about the PN, but failing to give me an interview. I am posting this very first e-mail with some of my comments:
“You have a considerably long paper trail behind you, and that is something quite difficult to forge. While I may not have any great trust of you at the moment, I do not have any great DIStrust of you either, and your approach to the subject matter appears quite scholarly. I do have over-arching concerns for the safety of the people with whom I relate on a daily basis, so you'll forgive my caution, I hope.”
So, I thought, great! He acknowledges that I have a valid research agenda and that I am *not* pretending to be someone else that I am not, but he is a bit careful. That is to be expected. The e-mail continued:
“I would be willing to share information so as to assist you in building a more balanced picture of events, but may have to omit details on occasion where safety or security would be compromised in the telling. If we approach such information in our discussions, I will let you know rather than simply fabricate information. In return, I hope that you will respect my need to keep some things in reserve. The PN do not operate in the virtual world alone.”
I thought, perfect, as I do want to take a more balanced approach and I don’t need the security details anyway. I want to hear about how the PN is related to the Internet at large. Of course, he is going to withhold some sensitive information. The e-mail continued to explain his organization and how the griefer collective re-imagines/reinvents the history of Second Life:
“Also, I have been running a fairly successful organization within this virtual environment for over two years now, and have acquired what I believe may be some interesting insights into the social dynamic of the metaverse within which we function. I believe that the principles involve essentially transcend the specific platform and may be applicable to other MMO environments as well. You may find some of my observations useful in your dissertation.
One thing I have noticed in particular about griefer groups, and the PN in particular, is that they have a very patchy, distorted perception of their own history - often rewriting the parts they find distasteful or unpleasant to suit their egos, and sometimes confusing the disinformation they disseminate with the actual events. They are frequently unable to communicate with one another except through the use of common memes, and this has a tendency to obfuscate communication to the point where critical information is either not conveyed, reimagined or forgotten. In particular, they seem to be able to clearly remember events going back only about four to five months at most, living almost completely in the moment.
- Kalel”
But he never responded to any of my e-mails after that. Realizing that he wasn’t interested in an interview, I stopped trying to contact him.
I graduated from my program in 2009 and it is around that time that I met Peter Ludlow.
When I approached him at the aforementioned conference, we had the idea to write a book that covered the phenomenon of griefing across the Internet. Peter said that it would be best for me to also “work” for the Herald and post some blogs. That I did. I posted some news reports on hackers in general but mainly focused on the book.
My goal with the book, at least in the Second Life section, was to tell the “untold” history of Second Life before it was too late - before the key players disappeared into thin air - before the history was forgotten. By that, I don’t mean the PG13 history of Second Life, the one sanctioned by Linden Lab. I wanted this to be the community’s story. Here’s a brief description of the book’s scope:
“Griefer Wars will begin by examining the early instances of the disruptive activities that took place in online communities such as LambdaMOO and Sims Online and investigate how Internet message boards (Something Awful Forums and 4chan) helped organize these solitary incidents into various movements that extend beyond these boards. In particular, the book will be discussing the presence of such movements in virtual worlds such as EvE Online and Second Life.”
With this goal in mind, I dusted off my previous interview scripts and re-started my field work. I reached out for old contacts and established new ones. I met a bunch of people from the Woodbury crowd (whom I never met before), met more from V5 and PN. I was able to reach out to some of the previous leaders of these groups (Verbana and ^ban^, for instance) and their officers who used to be in the inner circle of these groups. For the PN, that meant the Ghost Shirt Society (GSS) who really knew the ins and outs of their organizations and the psyops that had been conducted in the past.
It is around that time, I figured, contacting Kalel may be a good idea because in the e-mail that he had sent me in 2008, he told me that “[he] would be willing to share information so as to assist [me] in building a more balanced picture of events…” Despite many people’s warnings, who told me that this was a bad idea, I took the man for his word. After all, I wanted to relate a “balanced account” of the events that had occurred. Little did I know that he was not all together there after the infamous Wiki leak. Here’s my e-mail dated May 17, 2011:
“Greetings Kalel,
I had contacted you several years ago in the hopes that we could chat about JLU while I was writing my dissertation. Let me remind of you what I was doing at the time: I wrote on transmedia storytelling for my dissertation but looked at the development of spatial stories that emerged as a result of the activities of griefers. I graduated in 2009 but I am in the process of writing a book with Peter Ludlow on the phenomenon of griefers, but we are taking a broader approach to the topic. In other words, not only will we be looking at Second Life, but also other virtual worlds, various message boards, and other social networking sites. I am in the process of writing the Second Life section. I personally would like to take a well-rounded approach to the topic. So far I have spoken with some people from the PN,Woodbury, and I am in the process of scheduling interviews with some of the Linden Lab employees. In the hopes of hearing the JLU side of the story, I decided to send you another e-mail. As I see it, this project is an ethnographic research on Second Life as we are documenting some of the happenings that will be lost forever once the platform dies or evolves into something else. So I deem this project to be very valuable. But I would rather not tell a sided story, hence my e-mail to you. I am not affiliated with anyone or anything other than my research and I think JLU may have been short-changed in the process. Will you help me write your story? Or know of someone else who would be willing to chat with me?
Let me know.”
Response was a series of frantic, threatening e-mails. I am not going to quote them word for word, but rather, give you the gist of the madness that was coming through his e-mails. He told me that any material from the BrainiacWiki is copyrighted and that if I included any of that information in the book he’d be filing a DMCA challenge - and that they will wait until the book is in print and released before doing so. He told me that we may not quote him, anything from the Krypton Radio web site, or any web site he personally owned or edited.
He also spoke on behalf of other people: That he will also be notifying as many people as he could that Ludlow is doing this (For the record: I am not working for Ludlow; I am working with Ludlow), and that I would be receiving a number of other written notifications not to quote or include the writings of others in this work. Of course, none of these things happened. People were fairly open and understanding and I was respectful of my boundaries.
He also vengefully claimed that not only would he not be imparting any information to me, but that I was forbidden from using any information that he owned in my work.
Here is when it really got interesting: He was telling me that I may not reprint articles from the Herald that contained his intellectual property.
He also told me that I was dishonest with him in the first time when I e-mailed him in 2008 because I hadn’t told him that I was working with Ludlow. Then he proceeded to accuse Ludlow of being an IP thief because moved his servers to Canada after Kalel filed the DMCA. None of which, of course, was even remotely true. I didn’t start working with Ludlow before 2009; Ludlow didn’t mastermind the leaking operations, nor did he move his servers to Canada to avoid lawsuits, and he is not a thief of any sorts. I wish he was, really, for my sake, for the sake of the book, for the sake of my career. If we were to tell the story of the Philosophy professor going rogue, engaging in leaking operations, stealing intellectual property, putting babies on stakes, I would get my tenure - like now! But no, unfortunately, we have to deal with the boring story we have.
After the series of e-mails Kalel sent me (which were mostly gibberish and had no value to me whatsoever), I realized that he wasn’t going to assist me in writing a “balanced” story of the events after all.
Baffled, I responded by telling him never to threaten me or any other researcher this way again and that “I was merely extending my courtesy to [him] to allow me to write a better account of what JLU was and what its mission [was].” He sent another gibberish e-mail talking about copyright/DMCA etc., at which point I was getting tired of his e-mails and openly asked him:
“Kalel, I am not sure who you think you are interacting with right now. Clearly you have made a lot of assumptions about me and you don't even know me yet. I am not the alt of anyone, nor am I the spokesperson of anyone. I am not doing anyone else's work either… My question to you is simple: Would you be interested in interviewing with me and give me information about your organization and its role in Second Life? This would be your chance to tell me your side of the story as well. This is important to me because I strongly believe that Second Life is about to die as a platform and someone needs to document its history.”
And I stopped contacting him afterwards. But I thought that there maybe, just maybe, are some rational people among the ranks of JLU. I wasn’t mistaken: Greenlantern was kind enough to talk to me but was too scared to tell me anything BUT the press release. I kindly thanked him for his time and logged off.
Just to set the record straight since Kalel has accused me of this in his note to the Proactive Security folks: I don’t harass people over e-mail, IM, or in-world. If the Proactive Security people think that I am logging onto Second Life and repeatedly soliciting interviews from a list of people and harassing them, they are sorely mistaken. And they will wait for a long time for this to happen. I don’t beg for a date, I get asked on a date.
I wasn’t initially going to post this. Kalel getting bend out of shape over me is no-news, really. He should have better things to do with his time, like fighting crime, right? But several days ago, Angel Fluffy responded to a message that I had sent him four months ago. It was apparent to me that he was no longer in Second Life nor was he on Skype. He probably logged onto Skype after many months and saw my message and replied to me in the affirmative, saying that he would talk to me. But then he suddenly backed out. I can only assume that, from the notices that went out to the Proactive Security, that he believed Kalel’s mad fabrications. Fair enough -- again, not an important incident in my life.
I am almost done with the Second Life chapters. And I must confess, the section does not paint a very flattering picture of the anti-griefing organizations in Second Life. But, let this be noted: this is not because I didn’t try to include their side of the story, but rather, they refused to talk to me on account of their insecurities.
Let’s be clear: I never misrepresented myself to anyone. I never “falsely” claimed to be a researcher. Peter Ludlow is not an IP thief. He wasn’t even around when the Wrong Hands leaked the Wiki, his paper was merely reporting on the news story. In fact, Brainiac, from what I gather, had been leaked many times by various other groups (not just the Wrong Hands) prior to the last incident. More important, Kalel should thank his stars that Pixeleen isn’t taking him to court for filing frivolous DMCA complaints. But this may, of course, change in the long run. Who knows? Time will tell.
But, I do believe that we have to look what’s really at issue here as we’re building this brave new world in cyberspace.
There is one rather minor conclusion and another, a larger one, that relates to digital culture in general. Both of these should be addressed here:
The most immediate conclusion is regarding the griefer pathology. I’ve been doing research on griefing since 2006. But never, prior to my interaction with Kalel, did I understands the damaging effects that griefing could have on a person’s psyche. After the series of paranoid e-mails I received from him, it was clear to me that the Wrong Hand didn’t just breach the JLU’s security (which was a joke to begin with), but also, effectively turned the JLU into a paranoid collective. It used to be a group that fought for peace, order, and society, that’s for sure. But now, it cloaked itself in secrecy, painfully trying to hide its scars by flinging false accusations to where they don’t belong. Perhaps it was in this respect that the Wrong Hands was most successful.
The other issue to be noted here is a larger one that pertains to society as a whole.
The frivolous use of DMCA/intellectual property claims to stifle creativity, but in this case, to avoid accountability, silence freedom of speech, and jam open discussion. The copyright war that is being waged today (not just in the case of Kalel, who lost his battle with the Alphaville Herald) is a war of prohibition. Characterizing the Digital Millenium Copyright Act (DMCA) as “Orwellian,” Lawrence Lessig (2004), a law professor, openly claims that this law is frequently invoked to control the spread of information. “The DMCA was enacted as a response to copyright owners’ first fear about cyberspace. The fear that copyright effectively was dead” (Free Culture, 157). It is a way to stifle creativity, valid research, and dissenting opinions. And it criminalizes the society. I would argue that the issues that are taking place in Second Life are merely the mirror image of this problem. Make no mistake, popcorn farts or not: this is the Wikileaks generation. The US government couldn’t stop it; I doubt a group wearing spandex will.
Tux
Aug 21st, 2011
Due to the current revelations why am I not surprised?
Atlouis
Aug 21st, 2011
Many of those labeled as griefers by the JLU were nothing of the sort and simply people pushing back against what they perceived was the JLU assuming a role they had no right to assume. Kalel is a delusional fiction of his own imagination that seems to have infected the loyal members around him – many of which have no idea the true nature of the man they take as the word upon high. Sadly, some such as GLE, Vagabond Carter, and Zenmondo Wormser are very much so aware and continue to feed the masses nonsensical bullshit explanations.
Given the recent disembowelment the JLU is experiencing on the SL Universe forums (http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/general-sl-discussion/63339-jlu-harvesting-ip-addresses-60.html), it appears that the community as a whole is finally learning why numerous groups and individuals actually had a valid reason for pushing back against them. It’s about fucking time.
PaleFire
Aug 21st, 2011
Yes… and that story is soon coming to a theater near you
For now, you have to just read about what I had to suffer when trying to get this group to talk to me.
General Drama
Aug 21st, 2011
Turns out the SLUniverse drama is a hoax start to finish: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7202?focusedCommentId=279234#comment-279234
Atlouis
Aug 21st, 2011
Intlib, you should go read the 50 plus pages of the SLU forum before you open your fat ass all over these comments in such an unsurprising uneducated fashion. It has nothing to do with IP addresses at this point.
The List SL
Aug 21st, 2011
Hoax my ass. Go back to KryptonRadio, cape wearing masked faggot.
For the truth visit us: http://thelistsl.blogspot.com/
GreenLantern Excelsior
Aug 21st, 2011
Yeah, it was all about IP addresses until that whole thing turned out to be a lie. Now it’s all about something else, Google search results, I think. 62 pages now, woo hoo!
Dontspill McGinnis
Aug 21st, 2011
GLE, It’s about what it has always been about, and I did tell you this before. The residents of Second Life don’t need you, and they certainly don’t want you.
Take a look at the names over at SL Universe. There are a handful of TWH, but the vast majority are what you would call ordinary residents. (not that there is anything ordinary about any of them.)
There is not a single one saying “hey, these Superhero guys are okay.”
Time to wake up, GLE, and listen to the will of the people. This is the JLU’s own vote of no confidence, and its a landslide.
Tux
Aug 21st, 2011
Turns out GD is completely wrong.
Atlouis
Aug 21st, 2011
Keep in mind, GLE, it was not those terrible griefers that even made the thread on SLU – It was a resident with a valid question. This was followed my numerous other valid questions. Questions you did a shitty job of answering and an absolutely amazing job of turning into a shitstorm for your organization. While I take great pleasure in watching you make the situation worse, you thinking you won some kind of moral victory over the IP situation shows you have no concept of what it really is that is pissing everyone off. This is also why I refer to you as no better than any other member of the JLU despite others claiming you are “a good guy.” You think you’re being cutesy and funny in your comments, but nothing about these accusations regarding the JLU wiki are cute and/or funny. Keep up the good work, old man.
Atlouis
Aug 21st, 2011
Palefire, how you managed to keep your cool when speaking to these assholes is beyond me. Good on you for it and I hope you got the information you needed for your research.
Nidol
Aug 21st, 2011
GLE, look at this post, which happened over 10 pages before Soft made that comment on the JIRA
http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/general-sl-discussion/63339-jlu-harvesting-ip-addresses-45.html#post1353970
So no, it’s hasn’t about the IP logging for a while.
PaleFire
Aug 21st, 2011
@Atlouis The messages that Kalel sent out to Proactive Security people, making me out to be someone that I am not, was the straw that broke the camel’s back. This would have been the golden opportunity for them to tell their side of the story, but they threw it away.
If I were *really* working *for* Peter and I *really* wanted to write a sided-story that merely glorified griefers, I would have listened to Peter in the first place and *never* tried to interview Kalel or any of them.
But my conscious is clear: I did give them the opportunity and they refused. Anyone else who wants to talk to me is more than welcome to do so.
Robble Rubble
Aug 21st, 2011
in b4 DMCA
Dave
Aug 21st, 2011
Well, I was briefly in an ‘anti-griefer’ group. We were a tiny tiny speck on the Grid and we had more protesters and a terrible reputation. I left the group, not wanting to be marked as a vigilante.
Griefing is not an epidemic. But from what I have observed these anti-griefer groups have too much time on their hands and some serious control and esteem issues.
Sure mainland sandboxes and public spaces can be a wild and wolly adventure. Best solution to the ‘griefer problem’ is CTRL-Q.
hobo kelly
Aug 21st, 2011
I read something on some blog recently that really puts this into perspective. Linden Labs has some time ago merged the Teen Grid with the regular adult grid. This means that Kalel Venkman, GreenLantern Excelsior and their ilk are now collecting real life information on teenagers so that they can tack them and stalk them. This is very perverted. One call about this to the Simi Valley Sherriff’s office, along with the captured JLU data to prove it, along with Venkmans threats to shoot people if he thought they were PN would immediately get his Concealed Carry weapons permit suspended, if he has one. An investigation would be opened. This pervert shit by those spandex fucktards has got to stop. Linden Labs is apparently in on the teenager stalking as well if they do nothing about this.
LOL
Aug 21st, 2011
can I wear spandex and act like a flamer too?
Plz plz plz
can i
hobo kelly
Aug 22nd, 2011
Also, after reading that big story above I was a little dissapointed in the lack of any new tastey dirt on on the JLU pedos. You need to post those demented emails from Kalel en toto. Also dear researcher, you have missed the main point of the early griefing entirely. Well maybe you have not missed it because I have not read your book yet, but here is the thing: most all of the griefing that was done in the early days was a PUSH BACK. The “griefing” didn’t just occur spontaneously for no reason. It was a Push Back against certain avatars with Toxic personalities that were trying to game the system. Kalel Venkman. You think he is batshit crazy now? The PN didn’t decide to go after members of the JLU for no reason. In MY research of the last 5 years, most all of the PN targets were selected because there was MASSIVE faggotry going on with those people. Who else has a GIANT database on people in second life and uses it like a weapon whenever they feel threatened? Prokofy Neva. Those are the two biggest threats to people in Second Life today and they were there at the beginning when and where it all started. And the PN knew it. So when they do what looks like some general population griefing, it was usually very well thought out in advance and was used in precision fashion like a scalpel to bring the Toxic JLU and others out of their hidey holes and into the open where the shitstorm could happen and the pieces fall where they may. Look into the early history around Waterhead and Ravenglass. A lot of it started there. Please do a followup comment here in the comments section to post more of your data. You are now involved in a fight with Venkman, Excelsior, hog TimTam, and a bunch of others who do not know when to put their cartoon supercop Role Play activities to bed. Look at their RL pictures. Sad sad looking people who were obviously on the recieving end of years and years of scorn and ridicule in their younger days. They will try to tear you down now. They will convien their little groups and feel some relief in associating with other pedos as they sit around and talk shit to each other about you. Are you really prepared for that? Strike hard now if you know what is good for you. word up. meditation concept for the day: “PUSH BACK”
Nelson Jenkins
Aug 22nd, 2011
@ hobo kelly
I support this.
Kiddoh
Aug 22nd, 2011
I’m copyrighting this post! None of you better quote it or make a response to it using my username in your own posts or you are gonna be in BIG TROBLE!
~snorts a line of powdered Hostess Fruit Pies~
Pappy Enoch
Aug 22nd, 2011
It just shows to go you: don’t you trust no feller in tights.
And a cape?
Hoo whee.
hobo kelly
Aug 22nd, 2011
What that JIRA entry says, the link up there that someone posted, is that Soft Linden, who is probably in bed with Venkman, has taken that leaked set of resident names and IP addresses and has found the Second Life sim where they intersected, came together. Then going back in time by accessing backups they found the test device on that sim which was owned by a member of The Wrong Hands that appeared to be collecting IP data and that person has been turned over to the party Ban team for immediate banning.
Then Soft goes on to say that one of the members of the JLU has come to him with information that the JLU has been collecting massive amounts of IP addresses on residents up to the time that Red Zone was busted, and has been given this information and THEY ( JLU ) have been turned over to the Party Ban team too. He goes on to say that he is not sure if the huge resident dump of avatar / IP information this week came from one or the other.
Currently there is a big convention going on over at the Justice Island where new masonry techniques of building objects using Shit Bricks are being discussed by the JLU. I hope they know LL is listening in. Also, who was it that said recently that they have a chat spy device listening in on them?
This is a PERFECT example of how a “griefer” can bring the faggotry of anti-griefers out into the open. This should expose the link between Soft and JLU if there is one.
Glad your book isn’t to the printers yet. This should be EPIC.
Tux
Aug 22nd, 2011
@hobo kelly
Soft may be implying it was the TWH but he did NOT say it. He said the group was banned, the TWH is alive and well. We didn’t invite Kalel to come in on his alt to eject all the members! Like he did with Drone1 to W-Hat.
I have no idea who is. Although I do want Soft to call it out. That really would make an interesting turn of events.
Sarge Misfit
Aug 22nd, 2011
Since when is a database of information about people, collected without their knowledge or permission, copyrighted?
I wonder what DC Comics would have to say about how Venkman uses names from their comics.
Micaela Darkwatch
Aug 22nd, 2011
“But never, prior to my interaction with Kalel, did I understands the damaging effects that griefing could have on a person’s psyche……..But now, it cloaked itself in secrecy, painfully trying to hide its scars by flinging false accusations to where they don’t belong.”
Perhaps if Kalel and company weren’t keeping Super Secret dossier’s in their Super Secret wiki, on fellow Second Life users in the first place, they wouldn’t have to put the cloak of secrecy on.
I don’t care who the users were in the first place. It’s a sad existence to to search out RL info on people you don’t know and post it all over a private wiki for discussion. And oh yeah…stalking is a crime.
Senban Babii
Aug 22nd, 2011
@Palefire
“After the series of e-mails Kalel sent me (which were mostly gibberish and had no value to me whatsoever), I realized that he wasn’t going to assist me in writing a “balanced” story of the events after all.”
But that’s the thing here. That gibberish sent to you by Kalolcakes *is* their side of the story so in fact you *do* have a balanced story.
Glenn Beck
Aug 22nd, 2011
You know who else believed in ‘supermen’?
…Hitler.
At0m0 Beerbaum
Aug 22nd, 2011
Funny how most “griefers” on SL were basically people using SL to its fullest. aka, creating things and making their own little world.
Hell, if the JLU were really a force of peace and justice, they would have seen that woodbury wasnt the legion of doom. Hell while they focused on us (while nothing was going on whatsoever except you know… building stuff.) and making a huge issue out of our mere existence and finding tiny things to “AR party” us for. There were other groups crashing sims right and left. One of them even had a full sim and hid NOTHING about their activities.
The JLU ignored them and were convinced woodbury was behind every single attack on the grid.
Anything damnable that happened, happened towards the end before the big ban in April 2010. Which by that point everyone had it with SL and groups like the JLU, Emerald, and anyone else who was like “HURR YOU GUYS ARE BAD SO WE WANT YOU GONE”
The thing that made this funny and sad at the same time is how far and wide Kalel’s paranoia spread, and how much he glorified Tizzers Foxchase. and how much linden labs ate his bullshit.
What’s even funnier is how Tizzers baited the idiot along and he fell for it.
At0m0 Beerbaum
Aug 22nd, 2011
Also if Mr. Kalel wants talk about copyrights and such, he needs to realize that he’s trying to lay claim on copywritten characters, names, and the whole deal.
Superman, Brainiac, JLU, Justice League Unlimited are all copyrights of DC comics and Warner Brothers.
Warner Bros tends to look down on copyright infringement, you know, the kind where people use the likeness of their characters in an unauthorized manner?
Oh I forgot about the invisible unwritten laws that say it’s okay to do so because they’re “fans” Silly me!
Also if you know anything about copyright law, this isn’t covered under fair use laws either. Which also hold little or no sway in most copyright disputes, especially when the plaintiff makes billions.
Imnotgoing Sideways
Aug 22nd, 2011
Soft is a ‘he’? (o.o)
… (O_O)
Ohcrap! (@_@)
LOL
Aug 22nd, 2011
Well, I guess it is time put blog trolling on hold for a post or maybe two to actually post a pro-active comment. IDK how many SLH readers actually are prepared to Fuck with Kalel Venkman on the level he has fucked with Pix and the SLH. The only diffrence is, in this case the Faggot fanboys of the SL, JLU are in the wrong.
Join in giving Kalel Venkman a taste of his own tatics. For thoes of you who do not know the main JLU tatics when dealing with T.O.S. violations please allow me to enlighten you. The JLU’s tatics for dealing with griefers and Copywrite violations is to basicly flood Linden Lab with Abuse reports then wait around until an underpaid intern from LL arrives in game and bans\removes the avatar(s) &\or content.
So, Herald readers, bloggers, trolls, and of corse my fav nazi hunter Glenn Beck. Here is your call to arms, or rather E-mail, do what you do best, TYPE!
The Following is a List of Comic studios & Movie Studios Legal Departments who have posted thier contact information for the public to report violations of (TM) and Copywrites. so get your snapshots ready and send them here to show the real life copywrite holders just how thier profits, and trademarks are being blaitently stolen and perverted by an entire online community.
for DC Comics;
Copyright Agent
DC Comics
1700 Broadway
New York, NY 10019
Tel: (212) 636-5400, Legal Department
Email: dconline@dccomics.com
For Marvel Comics; http://marvel.com/help/category/13/topic/29
If you are aware or suspect any persons infringing on the intellectual property of Marvel, please contact infringements@marvel.com and describe the suspected infringement. Please be as detailed as possible so that the claim can be investigated properly.
Such examples of intellectual property infringement are:
1.Unlicensed merchandise using Marvel’s characters or names
2.Unapproved commercial use of Marvel characters or trademarks
3.Counterfeit products
4.Illegal copies of Marvel material being sold or distributed.
for the WB;
Copyright Agent
Warner Bros. Entertainment Inc.
c/o: Warner Bros. Advanced Digital Services, a division of Warner Bros. Technical Operations Inc.
4000 Warner Blvd.
Bldg. 168
Burbank, CA 91522
Tel: (818) 977 – 0018
Email: legal@wb.com
For Image comics press;
http://www.imagecomics.com/copyrightinfringement/
contact R. Scott Feldmann, via facsimile at (949) 263-8414, or mail at:
Crowell & Moring LLP
3 Park Plaza
20th Floor
Irvine, CA 92614
HAPPY HUNTING!!!!!!!
paul
Aug 22nd, 2011
@ hobo
As an outside observer, I have to say that your claim that the attacks by the early griefers were surgical and justified by the bad behavior of their targets rings fairly hollow. Clearly these JLU people have issues around authority and righteousness, but to suggest that the other side behaved in a deliberate, thoughtful, and rational fashion at best paints you (or them) as as much of a vigilante as venkmen and his ilk. Can you quantify or qualify “massive faggotry” in any meaningful or defensible way? Probably not. Don’t paint sophomoric shenanigans, vengence, intolerance, and petty and hurtful vandalism as noble..ironically, that is exactly what venkman does. It has always seemed to me that everyone gets out of SL what they put into it, and in that logic, the ‘griefers’ and the ‘vigilantes’ deserve each other.
@senban
I would like to see Kalel’s emails too, but I bet Pale Fire’s human subjects protocols prevent them from being posted.
Reader
Aug 22nd, 2011
If TWH has issues with RL data, its use and its presentation, they should flatly denounce TheListSL and reveal those behind it. You cannot have it both ways. If the JLU has reasons for what they do, they should make them public and clear – starting from the top guy. Kalel’s absence over on the SLU discussion is interesting but then again, that whole deal was obviously a complete set-up, even to the most casual of viewers. Maybe something will show up on the JLU site soon, who knows. (rhetorical)
If you strip away the mounds of childish crap that has gone on over at the SLU blog, it boils down to very little substantive dialogue. Kudos to those participants that don’t resort to name calling and repetitive deficit disorder. What starts off as a fine display of wit over there quickly turns to shit when analysis of what is really important simply gets lost in translation. Much of what that gang up approach ultimately leads to is a huge demonstration of immaturity with an unhealthy dose of insecurity on the part of the anti-JLU types. That is just how it reads to me. YMMV
Don’t get me wrong, there are fundamental problems with both parties in this squabble, and like Paul so succinctly states, “the ‘griefers’ and the ‘vigilantes’ deserve each other.”, but having carefully read through those 80+ pages on the SLU, the Captain Obvious types are …….well…… obvious, as are the missing in action types.
Senban Babii
Aug 22nd, 2011
@Paul
“I would like to see Kalel’s emails too, but I bet Pale Fire’s human subjects protocols prevent them from being posted.”
True enough. Getting things past academic ethics committees (or in this case human subjects protocols) can be a real goat. But at a guess I’d say the phrase “I’M SUPERMAN WHARRGARBL” is in there somewhere
In all fairness though, what I meant wasn’t so much that his emails should be published but rather the fact of how he and his minions handled being given a chance to tell their sides of the story for the purposes of genuine research speaks volumes. The way they handled things is in effect saying a lot about their cultural and organisational norms and that in itself presents a large part of the picture. It’s not just about what they say but how they say it. It’s not just about what they try to achieve but how they go about achieving it. So in that sense, Palefire does indeed have the balanced story. Both sides were given a fair chance to express themselves, both sides did so. How Kalolcakes chose to do so probably didn’t reflect well and it will be interesting to read this book when it comes out.
Dontspill McGinnis
Aug 22nd, 2011
@ Reader
Where the TheListSL is concerned, one can’t help but feel the JLU have been given a taste of their own medicine.
The JLU’s hoarding of real life information goes beyond Google, to include peoples health, spouses and even number of kids. On at least one occasion going so far as to trawl through local UK census records. It has been going on for years, and without consent. Lets not forget this is a group of amateurs playing a video game!
What is worse is that due to their incompetence, this sometimes sensitive information has been regularly leaked.
There is plenty of substantive dialogue, but it is all one way. The few JLU respondents who are attempting to quell the situation have been claiming ignorance, and Kalel Venkman has been too cowardly to talk in an open forum. (No surprise there!)
As I stated above in response to GLE, there are probably half a dozen TWH members posting over at SL Universe, The vast majority of posters are non affiliated, genuinely upset SL residents who not best pleased with the JLU and their methods.
Now if you’ll excuse me, I just got back from work and have 20 pages of childish crap to read.
Tux
Aug 22nd, 2011
@Reader
‘If TWH has issues with RL data, its use and its presentation, they should flatly denounce TheListSL and reveal those behind it.’
As a standing member of TWH I feel I should comment on this:
- The TWH does not link or encourage to RL info.
- The TWH will not denounce TheListSL because we are waiting for each new update as much as the next person.
- The TWH is unable to reveal those behind it because we don’t know who it is.
Also SLU is a forum. That is how forums go. Through it all people do deduce the facts and build the bigger picture. At least most do.
Finally, I don’t know where it is all going. But if this data is in a usable form, I would love a copy for ‘personal’ reference.
Yep
Aug 22nd, 2011
@LOL hit them where it hurts.
Wedebon Nosebleed
Aug 22nd, 2011
Best Griefer Story Ever:
http://alphavilleherald.com/2007/02/herald_correspo.html
Reader
Aug 22nd, 2011
“Lets not forget this is a group of amateurs playing a video game!”
You can say that again…
LOL
Aug 22nd, 2011
THIS IS AWSOME i see LOTS of people have actually read my pervious post and are RE-posting it on other websites!!!!
Guess I only have 1 thing left to do… Back to Blog Trolling
/me looks for a bridge
Reader
Aug 22nd, 2011
credibility shrugged:
“Could someone repost the picture of Kalel with his shiny groinal attachment, just to make us all smile? ”
post #2273 by Tux Winkler
http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/general-sl-discussion/63339-jlu-harvesting-ip-addresses-91.html#post1355943
“Lets not forget this is a group of amateurs playing a video game!”
Group? undoubtedly but not as large as many would think
Amateurs? no comment; maybe Captain Obvious would like to chime in here
Video Game? hardly but most definitely the first (bad) assumption that defined everything else that followed; applies equally to the JLU and TWH without preference or prejudice
LOL
Aug 22nd, 2011
why was the Batwing post removed?
GG3
Aug 22nd, 2011
The JLU is like a clogged toliet.
Flush it already LL
Reader
Aug 22nd, 2011
“Flush it already LL”
you meant to say plunge it right?
you know how that works right?
you have to plunge what you can’t flush because it’s clogged.
you know this right?
you just woke up from a nap didn’t you?
LOL
Aug 22nd, 2011
is it clogged from Kalel’s Batwing?
GG3
Aug 22nd, 2011
I think the word “purge” would be a better description
@LOL
Who knows what lurks in that toilet-bowel
LOL
Aug 23rd, 2011
@GG3
I guess thats why linden Lab calls it the Asshole server
err I mean assett
paul
Aug 23rd, 2011
Lol @ reader…concentrate…stay on task, buddy!
hobo kelly
Aug 23rd, 2011
I guess one funny thing that is going to come out of all of this will be all of the JLU wiki junk and KaloCales’s private emails and all that junk immortalized in an official Book when this researchers book comes out and it will have an ISBN number and will have a copy residing in the Library of Congress physically and also electronically immortalized for all time. Is that a lolz yet??
IntLibber
Aug 23rd, 2011
Atlas, that wasn’t me responding to you, it was clearly Kalolz, he seems to be trying to coopt that handle.